The Nikon BDC Reticle...your thoughts?

Originally Posted By: 2muchgunMine are 100(zero), 300, 400, 500, 600, 700(top of post).......

Ha! Knew i'd catch ya' using a reticle for downrange zeroing. My mrad reticle that i use as a trajectory compensating reticle is the HUMR posted above.

But i also have a MD reticle in this 6-18x optic for prairie dogs, but i run turrets for elevation and reticle for windage calcd. for a subtension unit of 2.4 IPHY between dots at 18x (mrad is cald. for 12x). It's a kick and a half to make a 1st shot connection at 300-500 yds. in
 
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Truth is, I don't really use it in that way much, because I only have 1 rig with a MD scope on it in which it will work with the chosen load and come out in perfect 100yd increments.

You can do it with other cartridges also, but there is a catch. You have to have the right BC and velocity for it to work (under predetermined conditions/variables ).

That is why I primarily just spin turrets and hold dead on....
 
Nice shot, BTW....
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Quote:Knockemdown, I gotta ask then what are the "right tools?"

For one, an accurate rifle/load. Any accuracy or velocity inconsistencies with your load will become increasingly evident with further distance. As will any flaws in your shooting form. These are two controllable variables that you can minimize the effects of BEFORE the shot...

Two, a good laser range finder to give you an accurate distance to compensate for. NO guessing, or reticle ranging. Sure, it can be done, but why bother when a LRF is sooooo much faster, easier & more precise? I mean we're trying to kill a deer here, right? No offense to SS at all, as I've a TON of respect for him, but IMHO, save the reticle range interpolation for p-dogs & steel, NOT game animals! Reticle ranging in that capacity is FUN and challenging! But stick with a LRF & consistent turrets for the meat. An accurate distance to target is another controllable varible that you can measure & account for BEFORE the shot...

THREE, a quality, REPEATABLE scope with solid turrets. This cannot be overstated! You, as a shooter, need to KNOW that when you dial a correction with that turret, that is is dialing TRUE. Click value of of .25MOA, .25IPHY, or .1mrad, your preference, they are all fine enough to dial in tight on a game animal for quite a fair distance. A proven dope card, in conjunction with repeatable turrets and a LRF and viola!, you just accounted for another varible BEFORE the shot
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A pocket weather meter is a handy tool for giving you atmospheric data that may effect your p.o.i. if not accounted for. This is another whole ball o' yarn that I won't get into, but suffice to say that bullet drop changes under different conditons & locations, and needs to be addressed before the shot...

Once you've got you range & atmospheric data, you can dial an elevation correction with a turret to effectively eliminate those variables out of the shot, for all intensive purposes. Then the shooter needs to focus on WIND, and rightfully so! That, again, is where a quality weather meter can help you...for wind doping. But there is still NO substitute for shooting that rifle in different windy conditions to see how you bullet reacts under them.
I liken it to having 'The FORCE', as Yoda would say. More art to it than science, IMHO. After while behind the rifle, you just kinda know how much wind to hold, after taking all of the available data into account. That being your wind meter reading at your shooting position, AND mirage, blowing grass, trees, rain, snow...etc.

WIND NEEDS TO BE CALLED AT THE SHOT. And it's YOUR call!
By then, EVERYTHING else has been accounted & compensated for, you just need to know your rifle and how it shoots in the wind.

Point being that there is NO reticle, turret, scope, rifle, or gadget that will make YOU a better shot without actually going out & shooting for yourself! That is the problem I have with 'gimmicky' type reticles, and my recommendation for using the 'right tools' & sound technique.

The 'right tools' and technique are not rifle/caliber specific, and be be employed regardless of them. Once you have this baseline knowledge and the proper gear, you can literally hop behind another rifle and drive away! No reticle to learn, no BDC circle jammies to cross reference drops for on the Internet, just do same/same as you would with your other stick that has the 'right tools' on it.

Make sense?






 
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Oh, were to begin?

I have a buddy that's has the BDC. I personally don't care for it. But, I do have the CS any really like it for what it was intended for. I have hit rocks just playing around out to 635 with my AR using this reticle and a range card that I compiled off of the Nikon Spoton web page by entering the correct data. SO, what is the best method for LR shooting at critters (not BR competition)? Its what works for YOU with the right KNOWLEDGE and PRACTICE! Buying a range compensating reticle and thinking you can hit anything you point at is foolish and unsportsman like. What ever a guy decides on and spending time at the bench and learning your system is invaluable.
 
Quote:point being that there is NO reticle, turret, scope, rifle, or gadget that will make YOU a better shot without actually going out & shooting for yourself! That is the problem I have with 'gimmicky' type reticles, and my recommendation for using the 'right tools' & sound technique.

The 'right tools' and technique are not rifle/caliber specific, and be be employed regardless of them. Once you have this baseline knowledge and the proper gear, you can literally hop behind another rifle and drive away! No reticle to learn, no BDC circle jammies to cross reference drops for on the Internet, just do same/same as you would with your other stick that has the 'right tools' on it.

Make sense?

Ok thanks. For the record, I already have the rifle, load, and the rangefinder. I was already planning on making a cheat sheet for elevation, otherwise the holdover points would be worthless. Also I already understand the need to practice with whatever I get, and I won't shoot past where I'm comforatble. I kinda thought this was a given but I guess I should have stated it in my original post. I'm not sure how I ever came across as a cowboy lookin to take pot shots...I can do that with my current set-up. The need for a new scope is because I want to extend my range without taking pot shots. Whatever I go with will require me to practice. If I don't know how my rifle shoots then I won't be comfortable, simple as that. Also for the record I was never going to use the BDC system as a rangefinder, only for holdover points.

At any rate it sounds like the BDC reticle is not the best, so this is my new plan. I'm looking at the Nikon Monarch 4-14x, with hand-turnable reticle adjustments. This will allow me to mark elevation and dial dope, which I think will be better. Thoughts on this?
 
Sounds like all you need then, is a good repeatable scope. Take your pic, but ya get what ya pay for!

Whichever scope you choose, test the turrets for yourself. Some scopes can be repeatable, but have inconsistent click values. As in, a turret may be labeled "1click=.25MOA", but you may find in your testing that you are getting a different value per click, avg.

You can test your scope's click values with out ever firing a shot. All ya need is a yard stick taped to a backer board at EXACTLY 100yds. Get your x hairs zeroed at the bottom up the yard stick, then secure the rifle so it does not move. (Ratchet straps & a Lead sled would work)

Zero out your ele. turret, then spin it up to 10 MOA. With .25MOA turrets, that correction should put your xhairs resting juuuust below 10.5" on the yard stick, showing you 10.47" dialed (1 MOA = 1.047" @ 100yds).

For instance, if your xhairs are right at 10" on the yard stick, then you know your turrets click in 1/4 IPHY (inch per hundred yards). Mis-labeled turrets are not uncommon with lesser scopes. If the value falls somewhere in between, then you need to do some math to figure it out.

Once noted, dial another 10 MOA UP on your turret, and measure again. this will tell you if you turret is tracking consistently throughout it's full range of travel, or if it starts poopin' the bed once you get past a certain point (another problem with lesser quality scopes)

HOWEVER, the 'problem' of a non exact turret isn't a fatal flaw, so long as the turret is repeatable in that value.



AS AN EXAMPLE, say you've proven that your scope is actually giving you only .237 MOA per click.

A ballistic program might tell you to dial 10.5 MOA UP for a 600yd shot with your rifle/load.

But THAT scope (with proven .237MOA clicks)is gonna need to be dialed to a correction of 11 MOA UP, to compensate for the smaller turret value per click, the NET result being a TRUE 10.5 MOA UP correction...

So as long as you map out your drops, you can account for a skewed turret value on your dope chart. And some ballistic programs (like EXBAL), will allow you to enter a 'custom turret value' to help comspensate for that issue...




Here again, is why guys who are serious about shooting at longer range just 'buck up' & drop the $Benjys$ for a quality riflescope with a proven track record for repeatability. This is why you read about guys braggin' up their NXS and higher line scopes all the time. Nope, you sure as heck don't need one for poppin' a coyote a 150yds, but when it's time to stretch the legs on your stick, a quality, proven scope is the only way to fly.
Which is also why you read about that "it ain't all about the glass". These higher line scopes run like a Timex, taking a lickin' & keepin' on clickin'. Substitute Rolex for the real sweet ones...
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Ain't this fun???

 
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I'll also ad a chronograph to the list of tools needed. Wether you guys let that go as a unmentioned take for granted thing or not. None of the above is worth spit unless you know exactly how fast those bullets are going. Getting it close out of some load book just wont cut it.
 
The Chronograph is just as important as the rangefinder and shooting techniques. The program Nikon has to calculate drop needs the speed of the bullet at the muzzle in order to calculate the drop of the bullet at each 100 yards increment.
 
I use the BDC reticle in my Nikon 3x32 and it does me good. Zero it in at 100 yards and go from there. Just put my info into the SpotOn web app and print out the reference sheet I keep taped to the stock.

bhammell
bestar15scopes.com
 
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I use to believe in Burris B-plex (nothing against Burris)...and even checked the values (in the field) knowing they did not match up perfectly but made my cheat sheet. But later found out variables such as temp, shot angle, barometric pressure, altitude changes everything...now for the really long (1000yrds) shooting east to west versus north to south also has an effect!

I'm just learning this stuff practicing on steal plates out to 700yrds with a 25-06 and a phone app...so I would recommend a good ballistic program and check out how much these variables can change the point of impact! I will never believe a custom dial or cheat sheet or B-plex will cover all situations after 300yrds...just my opinion....now if you want to run your ballistics through a phone app like istrelok each morning before heading into the field and see what those hash marks are valued at, that may be different

example your sight in was 30 degrees, level shooting and barometric pressure 30.06...your bullet will drop 24.1inches at 400yrds (25-06 100grn sierra 3150fps)
Now you are hunting, it happens to be 70 degrees, shooting at a slope of -12, and barometric of 29.9 and at 400yrds your drop is only 18.7inches.....how does a B-plex or custom turrent account for 5+inch difference...keep in mind you are hunting and that 1/2 inch shooting iron at the bench would become 2inch from a bench (at best) add excitement, awkward position, sticks or bipods, elevated heart rate that group would become 4 inches (at very best)....that adds up to have the potential of being 9+ inches off!....keep in mind this does not include wind estimation!

This is why I switched to MOA turrets and MOA hash marks and a ballistic calculator, wind meter and still cussing/learning the wind lol!....and yes still very much learning/practicing before I feel comfortable shooting at animals beyond 300yrds

This is just my opinion and right now my brain is just a sponge soaking up as much knowledge on LRH...my hat is off to the snipers of yesterday
 
Originally Posted By: Mark_in_MOshooting east to west versus north to south also has an effect!



^^^^^^This is good to know! It's one more good excuse I can throw out when I miss the next coyote.
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Hey, I feel like I should know a lil more about this whole directional thing before throwing out the excuse.

Should I blame it on the bullet going east to west or north to south?

Or west to east or south to north?
 
I'm a fan of the BDC reticle, I've written a little about it here. Just zero out your scope to a given distance, input the info on the SpotOn web app, print the reference sheet and take it out in the field. Really helps out on long shots you haven't zeroed for.

A key to this that sometimes people overlook is to make sure you're using consistant ammo between what you zero with and enter onto the SpotOn app and when you go out to shoot. This can make a big difference in if the aimpoint calculations are right or not.

bhammell
BestAR15Scopes.com
 
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