eotech ranging question

sendit223

sendit223

Active member
For those who use eotechs, do you have any handy rules of thumb for ranging coyote sized targets?

I have a 2 dot version (with 65 moa circle).

Then as for zero, I have it zeroed at 100, which puts me just under at 200. It's on a .223 shooting factory ammo, typically blue box Black Hills 60 gr VMAX.
 
I generally consider my EO-Tech as a 100 yard optic...I can guestimate pretty well on a large size target past that, i.e., a man sized silhouette pistol target at 200 yards and keep most shots in a specific portion of the target,,, but basically, mine experience is using it on closer multiple targets, or a horizontal moving target in the 40-50 yard range..

I'm referring to standing and shooting, sometimes with a sling,,not off of a bench or stable platform..
 
I pretty much sight all my optics in at 1- 1.5 high at 100. This puts me very close to dead on at 200 and still in the meat out to 250 or so. Being that I'm a caller I rarely shoot past 200 so this works very well. Truth is most of my shots, (thank God), are 100 yards are less. So to asnswer you question on using the EOTech to determine the range, I can't help there as it is pretty easy to tell if he is under 200 yards and that is about as far as I'm going to take a poke at him.

There are other optics such as the Nikon Coyote Special scope that has ranging reticles with circles that aid in making lonish shots at coyotes. These optics also have the magnification that is often necessary to place the distant shots with better precision.

Where the EOTech shines is fast target aquisition on closer targets. By closer I mean 100 yards give or take. EOTech Also makes a magnifier that helps place the longer shots with more precision. By adding a magnifier you gain a lot of vesatility with this sight. I've hunted with one quite a bit and they work very well. I watched John Bailey of EOTech make a 250 yard shot on a coyote with ease. All John did was put the dot a tad high on the coyote and let it fly.

Short answer is simply this. The EOTech is basically a 200 yard and in sight. At these yardages ranging should not be an issue. Simply sight it in 1-1.5 inches high at 100 yards and hold dead center of the chest on the coyotes and you should kill everything 250 yards in without thinking about it. If you hit him 1.5 high or 1.5 low of dead center you will kill every coyote you shoot at. In my experience these yardages will encompass 99 percent of you shot oportunities unless you live out on a prarrie where you routinley have 250-400 yard shots. If this is the case a magnified optic with ranging reticles would be a better option than a red dot type sight with no or little magnification.

Good Hunting, and God Bless,

Byron
 
Good advice and perspective. Thanks to both of you.

I should have mentioned that I am using the 3x magnifier. Byron, I had one of those 1% shots the other day. (Before the hate mail starts, this rancher wants these coyotes dead and I aim to oblige regardless of month of the year.)

2 minutes into the stand I spotted a coyote 800 yards out just laying there. He wouldn't respond to the electronic calls or the hand calls I tried. A full 50 minutes in I used another hand call and he changed his mind and slowly started coming. But at 330 yards he came to the crest of a hill and peered over it. Stuck again. I suspect he saw me when I originally set up given the way he spied over the hill and looked right at me. It was a windy day, I was ghillied up, I was in the shade and I had the wind in my favor. But he would not budge.

So, since I was cramping up after 60 minutes of looking through a 3x optic in an awkward position...I let the lead fly with an educated guess. I shot over and off he ran educated a bit wiser.

I understand my limitations and those of the sight pretty well and agree with everything you mention above. Even though it is a rare event, I am thinking ahead to next time. I was just curious if there was any dope out there for quick ranging via the sight (I use a laser when I have time and cover). Heck, if I'd of had it with me I would have slowly switched the eotech for my LaRue/Leupold 3.5x10.

Any ranging info would be appreciated.
 
I don't have an Eotech sight, but by looking at the reticle u should be able to use the 4 lines that extend from the circle for rangefinding with some degree of accuracy. I didn't see where they gave the subtension (measurement) of that part of the reticle anywhere but i'd bet the company knows what it is. Let's suppose for instance that it's 4 MOA (4.19 inch per 100 yds.) from top of circle to top of line. Figuring a coyote at 11" back to brisket (winter fur) avg. then here's the formula for stadiametric rangefinding--

tgt. size (") x range of reticle subtension measurement (usually 100 yds.) / subtension (") / quantity of subtension tgt. occupies (decimal equivalent) = range (yds.)

...looks complicated but actually super simple to apply--

remember 11" tgt., 4.19" per 100 yds. Substituting the unknowns here's what we get--

11 x 100 / 4.19 / 1.0 (red line fits coyote excatly from bottom of brisket to top of back) = 262 yds.

...if he's bigger than the line then he mnust be closer, right?

1100/4.19/0.9 (coyote is 9 tenths the size of the line)= 290

0.8=330

etc.

Here's your range sticker that u can attch to the gun someplace--

1.0-260
0.9-290
0.8-330
0.7-375
0.6-440

Now that's probably about the end of it since it's getting geometrically more difficult to interpolate precisely, etc.

Now that sight does have some long-range potential to it, again, to some degree of accuracy. There's a window between the dot and edge of circle that amounts to 32 MOA i take it. Suppose u know from your ballistics program profile for your load that at 450 yds. the bullet drops 5 MOA. Now 5/32 = 0.2. Now u know that if u aim 2 tenths the way down between the dot and the edge of the circle that u'll get...CLOSER...to the 450-yd. tgt. than if u just guessed. See how it works? What u've done now is turned that reticle into a rangefinding and ballistic reticle, sort of.
 
OK, just saw that 2-dot reticle. Now u have no less than 8 reticle points along it that can be used for stadiametric rangefinding, and the 2 dots are obviously some sort of ballistic reticle that have subtensions in MOA--perfect. Man, with your 3x converter i don't know what's stopping u.
 
Originally Posted By: sscoyoteSee how it works?

ummmmmmmmmm.....

Originally Posted By: sscoyoteMan, with your 3x converter i don't know what's stopping u.

besides my limited mental capacity? lol

Thanks ss, this is what I was looking for. I guess I'll have to find out from eotech what the dimensions are between the dots and the circle, etc.

Then I can get the calculator out.
 
Center dot to edge of donut is 32.5 MOA.

It says in the EOTech brochure, for a .223 62 gr. at 2900 fps amd the center dot zeroed at 50/200 yards, the lower dot will give a 500 yard zero.
The tick marks are 4 MOA from what I found.

I can't find their actual MOA sizes for the two-dot reticle features, other than that. I guess you could hang a grid at 100 yards and determine it fairly close.

Here's a short article on using it for range finding. Looks like a lot of guesswork to me, but it beats nothing.


EOTech range estimation

Your magnifier is 3.25X according to L3, also.
I've never looked through one, does it magnify the donut as well as the target?

One thing you may want to figure out is how to use that donut to pull lead on a runner. That may come in pretty handy.
wink.gif
 
Good info/link Evil. I would definitely find out what the subtension is of your 2 dot system. The company will know that or just measure it as Evil suggests.

Looks like i got a lucky guess on the 4 line subtensions. Find out if that includes the circle's line subtension too. That'll make a difference. I'm betting it's the same as the dot at 1 MOA, but may or may not be included in the line subtension as advertised.

At 4 MOA that should be just right for a rangefinding system on coyotes. I'd also find out if the subtensions of the lines magnify with the magnifier. All riflescopes magnify the image when a booster is attached, so consequently subtension remains the same. It should be the same for this system since your zeros probably don't change (i.e. subtension doesn't change). This should be apparent when the magnifier is in place as the lines/dots will appear to "grow" as the image increases. I'm amost certain that the subtensions will not change with a power increase, as if they did your zeros woiuld also have to change.

One very handy tool would be your point blank range rangefinding system with this reticle. I.e. if u know that PBR is 265 yds. then u could substitute that into the equation to calculate the subtension for that range--

1100/4.19/x = 265
x = 1.0

That means that if the coyote is as big or bigger than the 4 MOA line then just aim dead center and shoot. This can be done very quickly, and with practice u probably wouldn't even have to superimpose the line on the coyote--you'll just get a feel for it as you place the dot on the coyote.

You have to play with this stuff some to familiarize yourself with it. But whenever i get an optic i usually want to know what can be done with it, as sometimes even improvising the math in the field can be advantageous. Seen it happen many times now.

Remember you do 99% of the math BEFORE u go to the field.

U know why i love this stuff (which i do, BTW)? Finally found something i was taught in high school i can apply in the real world that's actually interesting. HA!
 
Originally Posted By: Evil_LurkerOne thing you may want to figure out is how to use that donut to pull lead on a runner. That may come in pretty handy.
wink.gif



That's an excellent observation.
 
Originally Posted By: Evil_Lurker
I've never looked through one, does it magnify the donut as well as the target?
Yes it does.

Good info Evil and ss. Thank you.

I got from L-3 that the lower dot splits the difference, i.e., 16.25 below the center dot. I responded with a question about the segment length (4MOA?) and if that includes the circle.
 
Well this is interesting. Here is the response regarding segment dimensions etc:

The questions:
(1) How tall (MOA) are the cross hair like segments?,

(2) how many MOA thick is the circle, and does the above measurement include the circle?

(3) how far between the dots on the two dot sight?

The responses:

1. The crosshairs are 8 moa in length

2. The line is 4 moa thick everywhere

3. The dots are not separated by any whole number of moa’s and are defined by the ballistic drop. However, they are approx. 9-10 moa apart.

Note this latter point is not consistent with what they told me earlier, i.e., "the lower dot is 16.25 below the center dot"
 
Quote:Note this latter point is not consistent with what they told me earlier, i.e., "the lower dot is 16.25 below the center dot"


I think the second answer is correct. I figured when you said before it was 1/2 way down that it was a weird coincidence. I believe it's a 500 yard aim point for 5.56 NATO ball from an M-4.

They didn't really answer part 2 correctly, but I'm fairly sure the 8MOA is outside of circle to end of hash mark (8+4 overall).

Take a look at this pic (click right image thumbnail), I blew it up and measured it and the hash marks are 2X the donut thickness.

EOTech reticle

From direct measuring that pic, the dots appear to be 7.7 MOA apart, but that looks like a marketing paste job and I don't trust it. (expand it to 200% and you'll see what I mean).

Now, look at this pic (multi-5.56 aim points):

557 AR223 reticle

400m = 5.6 MOA
500m = 10.5 MOA
600m = 16.6 MOA

If we were talking 500 yards instead of meters, 9-10 MOA would be pretty close.
 
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These sights are pretty straight forward I have never used it as a range finder but have shot it out to 200 yards at a silouette and have had great results.... I don't think it is really designed for long range at least without the magnifier and I have never used one with a magnifier.... This is an interesting thread I am going to check it all out... thanks for the info here is my Colt M4 with Eotech....

339kjmh.jpg
 
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Yeah, they're about a 250 yard solution, in my opinion. With my .223, if I can put the dot on fur within that range, it's pretty much a hit.

The one thing that would be interesting is to use it as a lead point on a running animal. I'll work up some estimates here on what it would look like as soon as I get motivated enough.
grin.gif


I tend to shoot brhind them, so any kind of visual "cue" would up my % I think.
 
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