Culling dogs......

To cull or not to cull is real simple, "If a dog doesn't meet your standards and you wanna cull it, thats your choice". I'm not willing to tell anyone else what those standards should be.I have culled dogs, and probably will again. I will never sell a dog I'm not willing to hunt.
Standards are an issue for each guy to decide on his own.
I do agree with prior post, not to sell "junk". That is where "personal preference" becomes "crooked" when dogs are not honestly represented.
 
A hunting dog should be treated like a tool kept clean and sharp and preform a useful job. When it does not then it should be replaced by one that does. That is much easier said than done, not counting the special hunters who get to live out their days because of what they were I have kept dogs others would not because I just liked the dog or some trait he had that suited me. I have a tendency to cull pretty close Dad always said it is just as cheap to feed a good one as a sorry one but good dogs are hard to come by. By culling usually means give away. One thing I have noticed though is a sorry hunter falls from favor pretty quick and usually don't hurt to bad to part company.
As for breeding I will not accept a pen bred pup, there is to much work and expense in raising and training not to start with the best genetic's available. I seldom breed to papers because I don't sell pups but try to breed to a known dog that has the trait's I want in a hunter. I am from N. Florida and run walkers for deer. I love a good dog but don't have much patience with a sorry one.
Sorry for rambling, there are as many different ideas for what makes good dogs as there are different ways to hunt, stay safe, stay legal and ethical and I hope everyone gets to own at least one true brag dog, that's the companion dog I am looking for.
 
Wow- What a thread about a sure not fun thing to talk about.

Culling is ABSOLUTELY necessary in a serious breeding/hunting program. That being said, to be serious, you don't need 300 dogs, a fancy kennel, a huge bank account and a famous name.

You simply need some good ole fashion love of what you are doing, a healthy ambition to make better dogs, some good dogs, some direction on how to get there, and a bunch of worn out boots. Then you add some buddies with similar goals, lots of game to help prove the pups, some more worn out boots and presto... You can make a difference.

The reasons to cull are up to the person that owns the dog. If you want perfection, well, good luck. Some things I can live with, granted the dog does most everything else right. No such thing as a "perfect dog", they ALL have faults.

If you need to cull... CULL! Don't give dogs away. If you know someone that wants to save a dogs life by taking your cull, give them directions to the local shelter and go shoot your cull.

Part of the problem now days is there are way to many dogs being bred... that should be CULLED. Don't nueter or spay them, and then give them away either. In my opinion, if you do... sooner or later you will hear about some horror story where you will be to blame for the sorry dog flesh you GAVE away. Just end it permanently.

You might say “I'm not a breeder so I don't need to cull.” Well life is way to short to follow sorry dogs. Once you see a REAL good one, you won't want anything less. It cost's the same to feed an ace as it does to feed a cull. You don't do anyone a favor, passing on a sorry dog.

I had an oldtimer friend of mine, that is no longer with us, tell me once. “Cull Young, Cull Hard and Cull Often, You'll have better dogs because of it” . “Cull before you breed and NEVER, NEVER, lower your standards to meet your dogs. Raise your dogs, to meet your standards!”

He was as good a hunter as I have ever known and had better dogs than I have seen since. Words I try to live by.

Take care.
 
I gotta remember your oldtimers line, that one sentence said what I wanted to in my post but much better. I do give away dogs, only to someone that they will be helping improve what they have or pups. Most people you are trying to help out the first question is what is wrong with the dog for me to be giving it away. I have given away some very good dogs usually older dogs that can help a young pack but could no longer keep up with mine.
 
To think or believe a good hunting dog only comes from good stock. Don't cut it IMB. I've seen both scenarios. I've also seen a dog that was frowned upon by the old hunters her 1st yr hunting. She was deemed unworthy & non-aggressive.

That female hound had numerous litters of pups her following yrs[she was used for breeding stock only].

Not until on a whim one day hunting coyotes. Did the last owner of that dog. Find out, she ended up being a holy terror on coyotes.

Some dogs you have a good notion early on, what their made of. Other dogs take time to mature.
 
Originally Posted By: kirbySome dogs you have a good notion early on, what their made of. Other dogs take time to mature.



This is very true and I have seen it a number of times, but in my breeding program I am going to cull those dogs and only breed for early starters. I know I will be culling some very good dogs that might have turned out later on in there years, but that is not what I want.
They say a child will learn more in the first 5 years of its life and I beaive the same is true with a dog...that they will learn more in the first year of their life. I think anything after that they are just $ucking hind teet their whole life.
The top dogs I have seen and been around,have always started early. Not saying there hasn't been top dogs that started later, but I think you get more of them that started early. IMO
 
Basically when it comes to hunting dogs (pets and companions being differnt) I'm not gonna bash on anyone for culling too hard. There are far too many people breeding and hunting dogs that refuse to cull in the name as the almighty dollar. The number of 3 year old "barely started" dogs being sold is amazing. It's been my experience that most of the dogs listed as started are really dogs that don't make the cut. Sure some dogs have been just sitting in the kennal but a good number of them have seen plenty of woods time and just plain suck.

Lack of culling and the almighty dollar has ruined a good many of the the coonhound strains. Cur's won't be far behind at the current rate.

CB
 
I have seen some very good dogs come from mediocre stock and a bunch that came out of champs that did not make what I would call a good dog, I am just saying if I am starting out with a pup he has to come from good hunting stock. A lot of the dogs that I will cull are the dogs that are good average hunters by the end of their second season who showed potential early, but at that age they need to be one that I can put on a track or cast with confidence. I would rather take a chance on a younger dog with potential making a crackerjack than feed a pack dog. I keep remembering the line from catdawg about lowering my standards to my pack or raising my pack to my standards.
 
Funny how diff guys have diff ideas. Some of the guys get cussed for started pups to young, some for startin them to late. Some like papers, some like pics and video of the parents and past litters.Some willing to "cull" at 1 year, some willin to feed a dink for "ever".
I'm not willin to say who is right or wrong, just "feed what ya like,like what ya feed," This has been around for years, but in today's world I would like to add somethin....
"Don't sell dinks".
 
I reckon I'm not like some dog guys. I don't believe in killing pups or yearlings, just because they don't turn out/stack-up to be a "great dog". Or the cream of the crop.

I'm talking mainly about people that breed looking for the "perfect dog". I don't believe for one minute there is such a thing, as "a World class dog". They all have their flaws, minute as they might be.

I agree a dog that is less than par. Shouldn't be sold/or given away, without it's past history given to the potential owner. I've seen that too. Not cool.

Most of the hounds we had, were bought from other fox/coyote hunters. Most we knew or have heard about their reputation from houndsman we trusted. Best I recall, we were burnt once? on a non-hacker. Most often we used our hounds in pr's or groups. Each hound, filling in the gap or lesser abilities of the other dog.

One of our old hunting bud's. Bought/[very expensive] two greyhound X's. They were fox/coyote dogs. They were 1/2 German Shepherd & 1/2 Greyhound. Both male litter mates, both very large, thick bodied & all the fight you could hope for. They were holy terrors.

Bad thing was, eventually they turned out to be livestock killers. Killed, is what they got. That I understand.
 
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One more thing. Anyone that actually believes for one minute. You have the "perfect dog" or cream of the crop. Then hunt that dog alone on a fresh [non-shot] coyote. You will find out in short oder, what your dog lacks.
 
My pup Jack[around 6 months old], all greyhound. Had him when I was a teenager. This dog was very mature acting when even as a pup. He could be running down a rabbit full stride. Once I would call his name, he would immediately halt & come right to me, right now.


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Gave him to one of our hunting buds, as I couldn't take care of him when I was young[no job]. Old friend would take Jack to work with him over the yrs. Buddy would leave water & food in his truck & let Jack out for relief on his work breaks.

Old friend could point out his truck window on the way home from work. Seeing a distant Red speck on the Winter snow. Friend would say "sick'em" & point towards the distant fox. Once Jack would see the red speck, he would go into alert. Friend would let him go. Jack would run out, catch & kill that fox. Bringing it back to my friends truck like a retriever dog.

One day Jack was turned loose "alone". On a relatively fresh 47 lb female coyote. Coyote kicked his rump good, a couple of times. Jack couldn't do it alone, no doubt.

Should've Jack been "culled"?
IMO, no but was worthy as a good hunting dog.
 
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Originally Posted By: Chris_Brice

Lack of culling and the almighty dollar has ruined a good many of the the coonhound strains. Cur's won't be far behind at the current rate.

CB

Amen!!!
 
My pup "Blue". She was part Greyhound & part Scottish Deerhound.

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She was my pet & hunting dog. Guys I hunted with made fun of her & razzed me for keeping her. She wasn't very aggressive as a pup. My Mother made me get rid of her when I was a teenager. I gave her to our old farmer houndsman friend, down by Creston Iowa. He only kept her for breeding stock, as she grew quite large, lanky & had some speed.

One day his hounds bayed a coyote in a brush pile. One by one, each of their best dogs was sent in the hole to pull that coyote out. That coyote had turned around in the brush pile & awaited each dog with a face full of ivory. After a short fight, each dog backed out, they 'd had their fill.

Out of frustration [I reckon]. Old Blue just happended to be along on that hunt. Clyde went & got her out of his dog box to try. He told her "sick'em" Blue. Blue went straight in & fought that coyote face to face for quite awhile. She eventually pulled that coyote out of the brushpile by the side of it's face. Clyde was surprised about how old Blue turned out to be a good dog after all.
 
Originally Posted By: kirbyI reckon I'm not like some dog guys. I don't believe in killing pups or yearlings, just because they don't turn out/stack-up to be a "great dog". Or the cream of the crop.

I'm talking mainly about people that breed looking for the "perfect dog". I don't believe for one minute there is such a thing, as "a World class dog". They all have their flaws, minute as they might be.

That is a sad statement. If you are not breeding with the perfect dog in mind ( even though you wont get it) then you shouldn't be breeding a dog period. That is why there are so many culls today. Too many people breed a dog just to get pups with no intent on getting or breeding for a great dog or a perfect dog. JMO
 
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