NEW Shotgun Pattern Test Results - Detail & Pic' heavy...

I prefer a center dense pattern for predators and turkeys rather than an evenly distributed pattern like one would use for bird hunting. For wingshooting or small game hunting like running rabbits an even pattern over a 30” circle at 40 yards is the standard for measurement. But turkey and predators are a different game and really that 10” at point of aim is what is critical. With that in mind I personally prefer that 10” inner circle at point of aim to be more saturated with shot than the outer circle of the pattern.

As to your question about the choke, you might call Carlson and see if they would exchange your particular choke for a different constriction until you find a pattern that suits you. Many companies will do that for you. I know that Kick’s, Indian Creek, and Pure Gold will exchange them as long as you pay the shipping. I don’t know if Carlson’s does that or not but it is worth a phone call. Otherwise call Chuck at Kick’s and see what he has to say about it.
 
Well I patterned my 870 Supermag with a 23" barrel, Indian Creek BDS, and Remington HD BB's 3" at 50 yards this past week. Pattern was less than ideal. I was very well centered, and in a 8" circle I only ended up with 2x pellets. The piece of paper was 10"x14", and I got around 10 pellets on the paper, but the center was very lacking. From what I can read on here, it seems that the Remington barrels like a .670 to .680 constriction with the BB to T shot sizes. Does that seem about right?

Looking around, there doesn't seem to be a lot of options in reasonably priced chokes for Remington in these constrictions. HS does make a "Undertake Hevi" tube though with a .675 constriction, for $15 this looks like a really good option to try out.

http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item.asp?sku=0005200655

I've got 2x boxes of the Remington HD 3" BB's now, and really want to find a choke to make these work reliably to 50+ yards, not sure what else is a good option for a tube. Any thoughts on this guys? I don't mind spending more $$$ on a tube, but not sure what else I should be looking at.
 
The Jelly Head usually does pretty well. You can't exchange it for other diameters if it doesn't work out though.

Have you thought about calling Indian Creek and explaining the issue to them? I think they will exchange that choke for another if you'd like and are willing to pay shipping cost.
 
No way I'd swap this Indian Creek. This thing puts 190-210 Hevi 13 #6's into a 10" circle at 40 yards........
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This gun is still my primary turkey gun and that Indian Creek setup is quite the turkey killer. I've shot several now between 40-52 yards that hardly even flopped.

I might have to try the Jelly Head, my only concern is that it's the same diameter as the BDS isn't it?
 
Agreed about the Indian Creek for turkeys! My M1S90 and IC .665" with the H-13 3-2-6 load does over 200 in 10" at 40 yards! That is a shredder for sure.
 
Rick i would go with a puregold in .670,i now run this in my 870s and my 11-87 and have had good results with the rem hd bb as well as deadcoyote.I am also running the .670 puregold in my browning with good results as well.
The puregold did just ok with 4 buck.
Pure gold also offers a buckshot tube in .696 as well that might be interesting.
I hear ya about the incredable patterns with the ICBDS and the heavy turkey shot,devastating.
I have now delegated the ICBDS tube to strictly turkey use as the puregold produced much better results with larger shot sizes.
I might add the ICBDS tube did not bad with lead 4 buck and i suspect it might do real well with lead BB,s.
Indian creek also offers different constrictions like .673 and such and will also make custom constrictions,something to think about.
I have heard some great reports about patternmaster long range tubes as well,they are the most expensive however.
A few pages back you can see my findings with an 11-87 puregold .670 and rem hd bb to give you a lttle idea of what you might get going that route.
That day i didnt have any 3 inch dead coyote to try but have since shot them through the puregold with similar results to the browning with the 3.5 inch deadcoyote,actually a little better.
I really think any long parallel section choke in .670 to .680 shold produce good patterns.
Yes the jelly head is .665 like the IC tube but i have found that they do produce quite different results in my guns so it may be worth a look.
I also shot a jellyhead with rem hd bb in my testing so theres a little feedback for ya there.
 
I would like to THANK each and every one of you that have posted or added to this thread. This has got to be the most informative shotgun pattern thread I have ever run across .I have read it from front to back and back to front and learned more in this one thread than in many years of just shooting, myself Keep up the great work and I hope to be able to add some of my findings in the future. THANSKS AGAIN , SUDDENTHUNDER!
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I figured it was my turn to contribute. Thanks to everyone that has posted! This is an awesone thread!

I went out and did a little patterning today at 61yds. After a few recent misses, I wanted to see what the new loads I am shooting are doing at 50+ yds. I had trouble finding my usual 3.5 #4 Buck this year, so I ended up with a few new loads. I did a quick 40yd pattern test before going out at the first part of the season, but I hadn't done a really good test. I made targets based on the measurments of the last several coyotes I killed. The targets aren't to scale, so the Vitals look a little long. All shots were at 61yds and from my usual sitting position. I wanted to see what my setup does under real hunting conditions. Here is what I found:

SHOTGUN: Tri-Star 12ga 3.5in chamber

MODS: Forcing cone, Dead Coyote choke, bore polished


Shotgun
DSC01583.jpg


Load #1:
Federal 2-3/4 #4 Buck 21 Pellet
6 Hits Total 3 In The Vitals
DSC02163.jpg


Load #2:
Winchester 3.5in 00 Buck 18 Pellet
7 Hits Total 6 Vitals
DSC02167.jpg


Load #3:
Federal 3in 2oz. Copper Plated BB's
19 Hits Total 14 Vital
DSC02167.jpg


Load #4:
Winchester 3.5in #4 Buck 54 Pellet
15 Hits Total 9 Vital
DSC02166.jpg


Load #5:
Federal High Density 3.5in 1-5/8Oz BB's
31 Hits Total 22 Vitals
DSC02164.jpg


Load #6:
Remington Wingmaster HD 3.5in 1-3/4oz BB's
25 Hits Total 23 Vitals
DSC02165.jpg
 
Does anyone know how the Remington HD compares to the Federal HD for penatration? I haven't tested the Federal load, but the Remington load has a lot better penetration at 50yds then #4 lead Buck.
 
My latest results...

01/09/2010 - SBE2 *New Barrel* Patterning Results with Pics


A little background...

I went through a series of exhaustive patterning sessions, putting ungodly amounts of money through my SBE2 and not finding any suitable patterns for predator shot (limited to T here in NJ).

I spoke with SBE2 and sent my gun back to them twice for factory testing.
I don't want to get into the details, but being I had to send it back twice is an indication the first time wasn't satisfactory (patterning done at 20 yards...yes 20 yards).

Anyway, Benelli sent the gun back with a new barrel, so I had to hit the range and re-pattern again. Worth noting, they also include a larger front bead to compensate for the high POI vs POA.

Below are the results of my first session with the new barrel.



Conditions:
-----------
Temperature 15-25F
Clear, sunny skies
Moderate winds 10-15mph


Shooting Details:
-----------------
Benelli SBE2/SBEII with C shim installed for lowest POI possible with stock shims.
Benelli's included larger front bead to further compensate for a high POI vs POA.
Gun barrel and previously used chokes cleaned and buffed with a power drill, copper brush, and solvent. Action cleaned and lightly oiled.
Bore snake with very light amount of solvent run through the gun between every single shot. Visually verified no debris or buildup in the barrel between shots. If seen, additional runs of the bore snake

until clean.

All shots taken from a leadSled off a table.
Patterning sheets are roughly 3'x3'
3" targets put on center of all patterning paper sheets.
All shot alignment was overlaying the center bead, front bed, and 3" target in 3 concentric circles with a flush view to the rear sight shelf of the barrel, i.e. the target is essentially covered by the

beads.

Below patterns are ONLY the ones I kept, all others were simply insufficient for hunting.


Chokes Tested:
------------------
.660 Rhino 2" Extended (Ported)
.660 Primos Jelly Head Choke Tube (Ported)
.665 Cabela's Choke Tubes for Hevi-Shot Turkey Super Full (Non Ported)
.675 Cabela's Choke Tubes for Hevi-Shot Turkey Extra Full (Non Ported)
.685 Kicks Ind Buck Kicker Full (Ported)
.695 HS Undertaker Hevi-shot (Ported)
Benelli Stock Modified
Benelli Stock Full



Shotshells:
-----------
Hevi-Shot Dead Coyote 12 3 1/2" T
Remington Wingmaster HD RW1235VT 12 3 1/2" 1350 1 5/8 T
Hevi-Shot Dead Coyote 12 3" T
Remington Wingmaster HD RW12VT 12 3" 1300 1 1/2 T
Remington Wingmaster HD RW12HMB 12 3" 1300 1 1/2 BB
Federal Premium Ultra-Shok™ High-Density™ 12 3-1/2" 1450 1-5/8 BB




Predator Shot Results (Subset of best shots):
---------------------------------------------

.665 Cabela's Choke Tubes for Hevi-Shot Turkey Super Full (Non Ported)
3.5" Remington Wingmaster HD BB
40 yards
Notes: Pretty impressive pattern for this gun honestly. One of the few decent ones with all of the aftermarket chokes I have and tried over the last 2 years.
762639343_pB3Ly-XL.jpg



.685 Kicks Ind Buck Kicker Full (Ported)
3" Dead Coyote
40 yards
Notes: A nice solid pattern with a high POI and a little right heavy, but nice clustering.
762639425_Xheih-XL.jpg



Benelli Stock Full Choke #1
3.5" Dead Coyote
40 yards
Notes: Very solid pattern, probably the best I've seen out of this gun ever for predator shot. Sadly and ironically, despite having like 15 aftermarket chokes, I get the best with the stock full.
762639739_bnVC2-XL.jpg



Benelli Stock Full Choke #2
3.5" Dead Coyote
40 yards
Notes: Not quite as good as the first but acceptable I think. Worth noting, I didn't anticipate shooting the stock full, just did it on the fly. So the choke was dirty, not polished. I think once

polished it will likely shoot even better.
762639494_qaFjx-XL.jpg



Benelli Stock Full Choke
3.5" Dead Coyote
50 yards
Notes: Given the 40 yard patterns, I wanted to try this combo at 50 yards to see how it did. Not mind blowing, but pretty decent considering the shot distance and adventure I've been on with this gun. Obviously a high POI, which is how this gun seems to be.
762639662_hzCVX-XL.jpg





Predator Shot Conclusions:
--------------------------
I think the new barrel has definitely made a huge difference in the overall patterns. At least now I have some legitimate options.
I think the stock full pattern (shot #1) is very solid. Not sure what's up with #2's variance, could be shell variance or the dirty choke?
I also think the 50 yard pattern of the stock full is doable for predators.

I'd still like to do some more testing to tune it some more, but I have an insane amount of money already in this gun, I really don't know how much more I want to invest.
I'm probably going to plan out one more session to go through the leftover ammo I have, and hunt with the stock full this season.
Looking back on that Kicks Full pattern, I think the Kicks should be tested a bit more.

I also want to play with more open chokes with this gun in that full choke range, which I believe is .695? Can anyone verify?
I have a .695 Kicks Light Full Ported, which is likely worth a shot.
The .695 HS Undertaker Hevi-shot didn't fair so well though in this session with any shells.
Also have a .695 Cabela's Hevi-shot Full (Non Ported), which given the .665 pattern with BB...might be worthwhile with the T.



*********************************************************************
*****************
**********************************************************************


Random Buckshot Results:
------------------------
.660 Rhino 2" Extended (Ported)
3.5" Remington 00
50 yards
Notes: I also shot this combo at 40 yards because it was the best buckshot combo with the old barrel. The 40 yards pattern was tighter than this and on par with my previous barrel's results. I think this

is a pretty acceptable 50 yard pattern for deer. The POI is off a little (could be me, head alignment or the gun) but it looks like 8+ pellets in a reasonable kill zone for a deer if the POI is adjusted.
762639153_aXy8s-XL.jpg


Here is the previous barrel and 40 yard pattern with this combo.
469969352_4FR8m-M.jpg




Buckshot Conclusions:
---------------------
I think the same combo I used before looks pretty solid for this new barrel. I didn't focus on buckshot testing at all really, just wanted to verify it was reasonable still. I don't often hunt with

buckshot, but when I do, I'd like to know it's hitting where I want.




Overall:
--------

What do you guys think?

 
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Dang! I really like the buckshot pattern. Wish my 870 gave me results like that. Buckshot is way cheaper and your putting a bunch of .33 cal pellets right in the boiler room. That's gotta leave a mark!
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GC,

Given the price of ammo and the number of chokes I try, I generally shoot just one unless the shot dictates a second look.

My line of thinking is, if it doesn't shoot good (I mean you'd never consider hunting with it at all) for one shot, that's enough for me to never take it afield.

I don't ever want to worry about my first shot not having "enough" to make the kill, but on the same token I do understand there is shell variance and patterns are never identical.

Of my recent patterns, which do you like best?

I think the BB offers more forgiveness from shear number of pellets but I'm leaning toward the T shot for getting the most punch against the eastern yotes.
 
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Avid,nice work on the testing.
I like your dead coyote pattern as well as rem hd bb patterns.
I think both will work good on called coyotes.
I have found that my guns shoot dead coyote and rem hd bb well so i choose to shoot both,fully confident shooting either one.
Sometimes i can get one and not the other here.
I think you will find that the rem hd bb hits just as hard as the dead coyote.
I have shot coyotes with both rounds with equally great results.Broadside passthroughs,broken legs,shoulder joints,spinal colums and fully penetrating head shots.
I wouldnt worry to much about the rem hd bb not haveing the umpf for eastern yotes,it crushes them good.
 
i can tell you the 3" dead coyote works GREAT!! this coyote dropped on the spot and i had ALOT of pellets in the vitals but, the shot was around 25yrds. one thing though, a few pellets penetrated into and thru the spine, hence the drop at the shot. the pic you see shows two bloody spots on his side, let me tell you it was pretty much like two big .44 holes along with pellets everywhere else.

jan2010coyotehunt002.jpg
 
AvidD,
Here is the set I like the best, lay this on a coyote and he is in trouble...

Benelli Stock Full Choke #1
3.5" Dead Coyote
40 yards
Notes: Very solid pattern, probably the best I've seen out of this gun ever for predator shot. Sadly and ironically, despite having like 15 aftermarket chokes, I get the best with the stock full.
 
Originally Posted By: GCAvidD,
Here is the set I like the best, lay this on a coyote and he is in trouble...

Benelli Stock Full Choke #1
3.5" Dead Coyote
40 yards
Notes: Very solid pattern, probably the best I've seen out of this gun ever for predator shot. Sadly and ironically, despite having like 15 aftermarket chokes, I get the best with the stock full.


GC:

Still working on finding satisfactory combination for my Benelli SGE using the .685" factory choke. Switched stock shims and got my pattern better centered, but so far not satisfied w/ four 40 yd. hits in 8" w/3 1/2" both SuperX 4B and Rem. 3" Mag 4B. (The only two buckshot loads I can get locally.)

Pattern is still just a tad low so plan to try one more shim and see if can center pattern a bit better. Given perfectly centered pattern, would have had 5 hits w/3 1/2" and 8 w/3".

What does the Benelli FC#1 measure? How did it do w/standard #4 buck?

Thanks for starting this great thread! I am just beginning to realize the amount of time/effort you (and others) have put into this project
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Regards,
hm
 
Just ordered the Dead Coyote choke and the HS Undertaker Hevi .675 for my 870 Supermag. I'm hoping to have some updates for you guys next weekend on the results. I'm pretty set on using the 3" HD BB load, so I'm going to try and find the right choke to make them really shoot well.

If these don't perform the way I want, I'll be trying the Pure Gold next. I just couldn't quite stomach the price of the Pure Gold, the HS was only $15, and the DC was only $26 through Midsouth. Figured I'd try them first before trying the pure gold.
 
I have a question after reading every one of these pages....Before I risk damaging the choke.... I shoot an 1187 supermag, 28" barrel with a patternmaster extended, black ported choke with OO buckshot for deer in certain spots. Its a freaking tack driver out to 70 yards with 13 of 18 pellets finding vitals.

However NJ laws say that at night, I cannot shoot buckshot for coyotes. It has to be between 4 and T. Thus ive been shooting Federals heavyweight coyote in a 3" BB load configuration.

Can the federal BB load in 3" be shot through the patternmaster without damage? Or will the fact that its a choke for 3 1/2" shell wads effect performance?

How do you guys suppose it would work on the 3 1/2" DC loads?

Thanks for any insight!
 
That 3 inch bb load can be shot through the patternmaster no problum.
I think you will find the patternmaster handles the 3.5 inch
deadcoyote load very well.
Still however dont take my word for it,you really need to go out and do some patterning.
Patterning will open up your eyes to what is really going on.
It also make you a better hunter giving you the coinfidence to make the shot count when you really need it.
In my opinion there is nothing worse than wondering if the gun your carrying is up to the task at hand.
Eliminate all the variables you can cause out there, theres a whole bunch you cant,those are the ones you need to concern yourself with, not the ones you can.
 
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