wanting 22-243 input

schne3

schne3

New member
Just had a buddy build a 22-243 and it shoots sweet. I would like some info on balistics and other load info. I also want to know if this is a cal. that I could make a full time deer rifle as well as a predator gun. Thanks for any info you can provide
 
hmm 22 cal will kill deer but it would not be my first choice for deer. Like my swifts yeah they will do the job but can be unpredictable on larger game happen to hit a shoulder and get a splash etc etc. your better choice would be the 243 load it down for yotes with like 55gr lead then heavier weights for deer. Also not sure but wondering how easy that caliber would be on barrels 220 is overbore that is even worse. Not sure if it is called the 22-243 middlestead but for some reason I thought the was named that.
 
The 22-243 is OUTSTANDING on deer. Ive used 80gr SMKs at 3500fps and they are intense destroyers of organs. Took one deer that had a fist sized exit hole on the exit side ribs.
The 60gr partition is another devistating deer load. Mine are running around 3800fps and it turns internal organs to mush. I hit one medium sized muley in the lungs and he spun in circles for about 3 seconds and when I got to him, the tree's were dripping with blood. I had to drag him a few yards before gutting him out because I was getting blood all over myself because of the low tree branches dragging against my cloths. My boots had blood all over them because the grass was covered in blood too. Another fist sized exit hole.
Killed a large muley at 300yds with the 80gr SMKs and it dropped like someone hit it in the head with a sledge hammer. You can even hear the bullet hit them with a loud thump. Took a large doe with it a while back. The bullet actually lifted her off her feet and all she did was kick a few times while sliding down a snow covered hill.

Just remember to use a hard bullet, you wont be dissapointed.
 
I am not sure because I have been asked the question before about it being a middlestead he called it a Win. My buddy is shooting a 90gr berger bullet rated for an 1 in 8 twist I am new to reloading but that is the box I saw on the bench. I am very sure of one thing this gun is super accurate.
 
Mine have been showing great accuracy too. Mine are 22-243 middlesteds but the only difference between it and the standard 22-243 win is the shoulder angle. The powder capacity is very close to the same between them.
I cant tell you how the 90gr bullets will perform on deer but the 80gr SMKs are great. The 75 and 80gr A-maxes are another good bullet to use as Ive got a friend with a 22-6mmAI that uses them with great killing performance.
 
I have a 22-243 middlestead with a 1-14 twist. i shoot 50 gr hornadays at 4100 fps. people can say what thet want but it will blast right thru a shoulder, ribs, etc with not problem. my wife recently killed a doe with it at 300 yards double lung went bout 5 yards. Awesome caliber!!!
 
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Originally Posted By: quarterboredA regular .243 will run 55 NBTs at 4100... and the BC is better than the 50 grain .22s... what's the point?

Can your 243 get a 35gr bullet to 5100fps? Can it get the 80gr bullets to 3600fps?

Unless your shooting over 400yds, BCs dont mean diddly unless your shooting paper. Compare BC's on the 224 80gr bullets and the BCs on the 244 80gr bullets. Ive calculated the BCs of a 224 75gr A-max at .610 by taking velocity reading at 10 feet, 100yds, 200yds and 300yds to get that BC calculation of that specific bullet.

Personally, Ive gotten the 55gr bullets to 4300fps in my 22-243 but had to back back down to 4200fps because of brass life.
 
Most dont understand how to decide on a 22-243. Quite frankly, when using the small bullets (50gr and less) the 22-250AI gives up very little to the 22-243. When going heavier (55-70 gr bullets) the 22-243 will be the most efficient of the overbore 224 cartriges. Now, after 70gr and up, the 22-6mm rem takes over. My 224 Clark gets those 80gr bullets to +3800fps safely.
They are hard on barrels also, very hard on them so their not exactly at home in a PD town
The 22-250AI requires fireforming of brass and I never liked that idea because that just means wear and tear on barrels even though accuracy is still superb while doing it. There are other methods of fireforming brass with the use of cream of wheat (I have not tried it myself). The 22-250AI also sufferes from having a shorter neck which I beleive makes accuracy harder to acheive. It also has a 40* neck which sometimes can cause feeding issues (that hasnt been my experience though).

The 22-243 comes in various types. The first more common type is the standard 243 necked down to 224 cal with nothing else changed. Its simple to build brass for but suffers from having that short neck and shallow shoulder angle. Case stretch can be bad if your pushing it hard.

The next more common 22-243 is called a "22-243 Middlested" This is the version I prefer but its not for everyone. The shoulder angle is changed to 30* while the shoulder is pushed back creating a longer neck. It does not need to be fireformed like the AI cartridges but the first firing does create sharper shoulder angles. I hunt with my fireforming brass and shoot targets with brass thats been ironed out to fit the chamber perfectly. It does not have the feeding issues like the AI cartridges but building the brass is time consuming.

The 22-243 AI hold more powder than the other two but once again, short neck and feeding issues.

The 224 clark is based on the 6mmrem brass but the shoulders are blown forward to 30* meaning it requires AI type fireforming. It has a nice long neck for holding those long bullets and its a real monster. Another version is the 22-6mm AI which requires fireforming also. The bad part of these cartridges is the poor quality brass up intil recently now that Lapua is offering better brass.

Then youve got the 22-284. This is a mean mother here. Ive read some reviews and a lot of comments include problems with bullets being able to withstand its power. Problems with this design is necking down the brass because it has a 35* shoulder angle. Iit requires several steps of neck sizing or the brass colapses.

Your desision is all yours as to which design of hotrod your after but your best if you have a specific bullet design planned before ordering your reamer. If your after small bullet hunting cartridge, the 22-250AI or the 22-250RCBS improved might fit your needs without going through the effort of all the brass prep. If your after heavy bullet performance, I really like my 224 clark.
If your after a medium weight do it all type, the 22-243 is a great compramise.

I read an article in an old firearms magazine about the Middlested. The author was getting almost 4000fps with the 60gr partition. He shot some balistic media and he said the bullet traveled 14" into the media before blowing up into a mushroom looking cavity, he use nuclear explosion as a visual effect.
 
I shoot a 22-243AI in a repeater without any feeding issues. My baby though is a 22-243AI single. A mild load of RL22 pushes the 80gr VLD out of the tube at 3600. Been up to 3800 but accuracy slacked off. It also likes to toss 40gr pills at 5200+ just for giggles
 
Originally Posted By: Outlawkyote Ive calculated the BCs of a 224 75gr A-max at .610 by taking velocity reading at 10 feet, 100yds, 200yds and 300yds to get that BC calculation of that specific bullet.

Personally, Ive gotten the 55gr bullets to 4300fps in my 22-243 but had to back back down to 4200fps because of brass life.

Pretty amazing how you get a .200 increase in the listed BC... convenient.

I've run the 55s up to about 4400 in the 6mm and .243... brass life is short though. Apples to apples... you're talking about what is esentially a .243 AI necked down... if you're going to fireform... why neck it down too. The .243AI is a bad machine... I know... I've been shooting one for 15-20 years... it's called the 6mm Rem.

The 87 Vmax has nearly the same listed BC as the 75 .22 Axax (.400 vs. .421)... I can run them at close to 3500 in the 6mm rem... and I guarantee they hit harder than your 75 Amax.

Fireforming... special dies... 75-80k/psi to get velocities... all for the 'cool' factor of shooting a round that someone else doesn't. Seems a little like wearing pink hot pants to church just because everyone else is wearing a suit.

But hey... we're talking about paper tigers here... so I don't want to get in the way of pipe dreams.
 
I'm not sure I understand why your really wanting something like that? Of course there doesn't have to be a reason! Want is enough. It would seem to me that it's greatest use would be with heavy bullet's, not light. Any improvement over the 220 Swift or the 22-250 is just bragging rights. I am reading some pretty impressive velocities though. Not sure how well how well a 35gr bullet would hold up on a tit mouse much less anything larger when pushed to 5100fps. Perhaps with a solid copper bullet.Hornady makes a 35gr V-Max, B.C. .109. It's rated for MV at between 1500 and 4400fps; 5100fps might be a bit hard on it.

As far as being a full time deer cartridge, well, I coul;d hunt deer for the rest of my life with a 22 LR and kill a lot of deer with one shot. Personally I don't see any 22 as an honest deer cartridge.
 
Quarterbored, when did this turn into a game of Who's got the longer hanger? A question was asked about a caliber and it was answered. You're acting just like the guys that jump in and beat on their chests about Savage when a question about another brand comes up. If the kid wants one why try talking him out of it. And are we honestly going to get into the 75-80k psi deal again? open your eyes brother
 
Outlaw, I don't remember offhand but I will look through my records for you. I tried about 6 different powders to see what it would top off at. If I'm thinking right it was either 4895 or Win748 but I'll make sure
 
Physics is physics... hate to point it out brother... but it is what it is. Magic pixie dust... whatever... if it's faster and smaller caliber using the same brass... the the pressure is greater... PERIOD. We're talking about a parent cartridge running in the 60-65k/psi... so in order to go faster with the same capacity and a smaller hole... the pressure has to rise drastically.

THERE AIN'T NO FREE LUNCH... and I'll call a spade a spade on every one of these threads that spews forth the ballictic vomit that these .224TTH and .22/243 topics seems to inherently ooze.
 
Ok Professor Physics I'm not getting into this with you again. I myself do not have the nessicary equipment to test pressures so I went by Quickload software which by listening to the people that do have the equipment is very close. Going by my action, barrel, case, powder, primer, oal, and being 10thou into the lands gives me a reading of 63,922psi, which is a little hot. Now granted, it might not be spot on but its a [beeep] of a long way from the 75-85,000 that you quoted in this and other posts. Do you have any idea what a that case would do at 85,000psi? Do some research before you open your mouth and save your ballistic vomit threads as you call them for people that actually believe the [beeep] that you're trying to tell them
 
I've seen cases take over 100k and all that went south was the primer pockets. But hey... that was in an actuall ballistics lab of a major bullet manufacturer... so what do I know?

I've seen some Quickload stuff that wasn't anywhere close... but again... it's hard to take pixie dust into account.
 
Quarterbored

Why would I neck a 6mm cartridge down. Its Simple: Because I dislike the 6mm crown after having two 243's a 6mm rem and a 6mm-284. I neck down the brass because the 224 bullets float my boat. Do I need another reason?

I have a 6mm06AI reamer in my tool box that was purchased for me so I could build another person a rifle with it. Its only been used once, unless he wants another barrel built, I doubt it will ever get used again.

Getting a BC of 610 with the 75gr A-max was not convenient actually. I had to shoot through my chrono screens at several different distances so I could see what the true (not advertised) Bcs of that bullet were. It was time consuming and a pain in the arse.

As for the 87gr bullets, My 2506AI gets 85gr noslers to +3800 fps. My 6mm 284 only got the 85's to 3600 so I sold it. Hence, not impressed with the 6mm cartridges.

As for fireforming, its not nessisary in my 22-243 middlested. The loading dies makes the brass come out almost perfect. As perfect as factory brass in any cartridge sold over the shelve.

Ya got a problem with wildcatting or something?

How about a 6.8 SPC necked down to .204? shown in the middle standing next to a 204 ruger on the right

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3900fps with a 50gr berger or 4200 with a 40gr nosler.

Ya dont like guns enough to fool around with wildcatting or something? I like guns....eeerr.... I like "improved" guns. I like uniquie guns. Maybe it comes from all the time Ive spent at ramshots labs. Maybe it comes from living next door to their loading tech' for 6 years. Maybe it comes from knowing the guys up there and becoming good friends with them. Maybe I just make too much money and I gotta spend it before my wife does?

How about a long neck 22-250? Built one of those a while back too. 22 dashers? how about a 221fireball AI? 280AI? done those too. Had fun with all of them (except the 221, havent played with it yet).

Dont poop in my wheaties just because Im having fun. Maybe Ill have that 6mm06AI reamer sent back and have it cut down to .224 also? Sounds like a kick in the butt to me. Whack a few coyotes with it and see how it does? Maybe kill another buffalo using it as an experiment? Maybe blast a few shoehares with it? Maybe a couple PDs in the snow with it just to see how large a diameter of red snow I can make?

I LIKE GUNS!!!
 
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