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#1123656 - 11/26/08 08:32 PM New cat dogs
Duane@ssu Offline
Retired moderator

Registered: 04/24/01
Posts: 4095
Loc: Gods Country
I went 700 miles one way to buy a finished cat dog,and ended up with a prospect also.Got home late last nite.
Solid dog


Prospect

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"IF YOU'RE GONNA TALK SMART,YOU BETTER RIDE A FAST HORSE"








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#1123657 - 11/26/08 08:58 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Duane@ssu]
Devin69 Offline
Die Hard Member II

Registered: 11/16/08
Posts: 1467
Loc: Craig Colorado
I like the looks of that dog. What is the breeding? It looks to be half hound and half cur???????
Am I close ? Anyway good luck with it, you will have to keep us posted.
_________________________
LIGHTNING RIDGE KENNELS Walker breeding at it's best Used to Catch Big Game Our choice is as simple as Black and White

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#1123658 - 11/26/08 11:46 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Devin69]
Duane@ssu Offline
Retired moderator

Registered: 04/24/01
Posts: 4095
Loc: Gods Country
Its actually 2 dogs,the first 2 pics are a solid cat dog,the second 2 are a prospect.As for "breeding"
I'll just say bi#$h that hunts X stud that hunts.
Not trying to be smart but they come from a guy that makes a livin runnin cats and bears on dry ground.He has run his own line of dogs for 30 years.These might be the "real deal".
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"IF YOU'RE GONNA TALK SMART,YOU BETTER RIDE A FAST HORSE"








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#1123659 - 11/27/08 12:32 AM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Duane@ssu]
mikegranger Offline
Retired Admin/moderator

Registered: 11/17/01
Posts: 4057
Loc: Lewistown, Mt USA
Good looking dogs Duanne. Looking forward to some great stories of the finished dog and the prospect.
_________________________
Endeavor to Persevere!

Mike




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#1123660 - 11/27/08 02:06 AM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Duane@ssu]
Devin69 Offline
Die Hard Member II

Registered: 11/16/08
Posts: 1467
Loc: Craig Colorado
Quote:

Its actually 2 dogs,the first 2 pics are a solid cat dog,the second 2 are a prospect.As for "breeding"
I'll just say bi#$h that hunts X stud that hunts.
Not trying to be smart but they come from a guy that makes a livin runnin cats and bears on dry ground.He has run his own line of dogs for 30 years.These might be the "real deal".


Hope they work for you. Good luck with them.
_________________________
LIGHTNING RIDGE KENNELS Walker breeding at it's best Used to Catch Big Game Our choice is as simple as Black and White

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#1123661 - 11/28/08 08:18 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Devin69]
Duane@ssu Offline
Retired moderator

Registered: 04/24/01
Posts: 4095
Loc: Gods Country
Devin, I hope you know I wasn't bein smart.When it comes to dogs,I don't follow paper,nor do I put any stock in it.
These dogs are a "cross of decades of dogs" there is no way to tell what all they have in them.I know some other dogs from these lines and they have as many different colors as there are stars.I'm goin huntin in a few hours,By daylight I might have a "feel" for the finished dog.
_________________________


"IF YOU'RE GONNA TALK SMART,YOU BETTER RIDE A FAST HORSE"








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#1123662 - 11/29/08 02:14 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Duane@ssu]
Oklahunter Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/03/05
Posts: 39
Loc: Colorado
Nice looking hounds. How old are they?

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#1123663 - 11/29/08 07:02 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Oklahunter]
Devin69 Offline
Die Hard Member II

Registered: 11/16/08
Posts: 1467
Loc: Craig Colorado
You must believe in some kind of paper trail if you have followed decades of breeding of these dogs.
Anyway I hope they work for you. I was just curious of the breeding, Because I am a fan of good breeding weather it be on paper or some good ole hunter that has done his own for decades is no different, breeding the best to the best(and even that doesn't mean it will work).
We are all looking for the golden goose or in this case the golden dog. I think if there was such a thing ..... the perfect breed, that could reproduce the perfect offspring, the person or persons that had this would be rich, rich, rich.
Keep us updated on your success.I hope those turn out to be the golden dogs, hey at least I can say I know someone that had some golden dogs lol
_________________________
LIGHTNING RIDGE KENNELS Walker breeding at it's best Used to Catch Big Game Our choice is as simple as Black and White

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#1123664 - 11/29/08 07:41 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Devin69]
Duane@ssu Offline
Retired moderator

Registered: 04/24/01
Posts: 4095
Loc: Gods Country
Devin I agree with you.The best plan I have come up with,is to start with the best parents I can find and pray to get the best pups out of the litter.Then just do it over and over,with different dogs,hoping it works.This whole dog breeding game is more"witchcraft than science" (basicly luck)You are right,If I had all the answers I wouldn't be feedin cattle and balin hay.HaHa.
_________________________


"IF YOU'RE GONNA TALK SMART,YOU BETTER RIDE A FAST HORSE"








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#1123665 - 11/29/08 09:22 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Duane@ssu]
Devin69 Offline
Die Hard Member II

Registered: 11/16/08
Posts: 1467
Loc: Craig Colorado
I like how Onstott put it in his book The New Art of Breeding the Better Dogs.

" Fine dogs of whatever breed are things of beauty. The consistent production of them through the intelligent employment of the laws of heredity to perpetuate the desirable in the ancestral germ plasms and to eliminate the undesirable is artistry of a high order. And it is as an art, with a full awareness of it as such, and only so, that the breeding of dogs should be seriously undertaken."

Another quote I enjoy that made me think of my own breeding program and others that have been breeding their own lines for years and years is.

" They have been so interested in the trees of their own kennel that they have failed to see the vast forest of biology."

Got me thinking to be always open to what another man has because he just might have something better than I do and I might be too wrapped up and proud of my own breeding to realize what he has.


I would love to sit and pick the brains of some of the great breeders of our time or the old.
One of the finest breeders of big game hounds lives in Oregon, Sam Faulk , has some of the strongest genitics I have ever seen in a dog. I would love to sit down with Sam and find out how he bred his dogs and what his secerts were, Something we will will never know I am afraid. My buddy and I bought Sam's last 3 dogs from him at $10,000 each and they have been worth every penny. Sold one of them 2 months ago for $3500, she was 14 years old , we ran her for 7 years and put tons of game up a tree with her and got many fine pups from her.
Oh heck listen to me , I could ramble all night about dogs and breeding them. Sorry


Edited by Devin69 (11/29/08 09:26 PM)
_________________________
LIGHTNING RIDGE KENNELS Walker breeding at it's best Used to Catch Big Game Our choice is as simple as Black and White

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#1123666 - 11/29/08 09:28 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Duane@ssu]
mikegranger Offline
Retired Admin/moderator

Registered: 11/17/01
Posts: 4057
Loc: Lewistown, Mt USA
A quote from my lovely wife "You paid how much for Bubba and he doesn't have papers?" I like a papered dog as much as the next guy but in the end what's really important is "does the dog hunt". My grandpa was into coon hounds more than any man I ever knew. He was always looking for dogs with good papered bloodlines. But, he always bred to a proven hunter, papered or not. Granted, he sold dogs by hunting them. Not many were sold before a good night of hunting. The buyer either heard about the dog or was on the hunt.
_________________________
Endeavor to Persevere!

Mike




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#1123667 - 11/29/08 09:33 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Devin69]
mikegranger Offline
Retired Admin/moderator

Registered: 11/17/01
Posts: 4057
Loc: Lewistown, Mt USA
Devin,

Rambling is good. We like hearing about what other guys do and the roads they've traveled. That's what's so special about PM. We are a group of guys who like hunting, shooting, and hounds. Sounds like you have a lot of experience with dogs and we look forward to your input. Keep it coming.
_________________________
Endeavor to Persevere!

Mike




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#1123668 - 11/29/08 10:02 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: mikegranger]
Devin69 Offline
Die Hard Member II

Registered: 11/16/08
Posts: 1467
Loc: Craig Colorado
Mike, Boy aint that the truth. We have to look at what we want, do we want a great hunting dog or do we want a great hunting dog with the ability to reproduce itself? Most of us are just happy with a great hunting dog until they get old or die early.
One of the best hunting dogs I have ever owned is half Jagd terrier and half walker hound, just a super hunting dog, But she couldn't reproduce her likeness if her life depended on it.And her parents never reproduce another good dog as long as they lived. And that is were geneticts play into the art of breeding.
Another quote and I will stop.
" The likelihood of this being accomplished (breeding best to best)in a single breeding , even from a sire and dam of undeniable excellence,is of the same order as the total numbers in a Mexican lottery. It is true that in the lottery someone wins , but we are stressing the probability, not the win.The purpose of geneticts is to "rig" the lottery so that the probability of winning is increased."

Don't get me wrong I am not promoting the registared dog, I find the UKC , AKC PKC and others just money hungry. But they are doing something that most people are too lazy to do themselves and that is write down a pedigree or a history of the dogs they have had ,and bred, and what worked and what did not work. Without that history we are just buying a lottery ticket. I got lucky and won a pretty good lottery with my half Jagd and half Walker hound but in the long run it would have been better if I could have reproduced her.
_________________________
LIGHTNING RIDGE KENNELS Walker breeding at it's best Used to Catch Big Game Our choice is as simple as Black and White

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#1123669 - 11/29/08 11:28 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Devin69]
Duane@ssu Offline
Retired moderator

Registered: 04/24/01
Posts: 4095
Loc: Gods Country
Devin,just remember,"you can have a dink out of a good litter or a superstar out of a dink litter,no matter what the papers." No debate, you have now, and have had in the past some great dogs,you need no advice from me.Just keep an open mind ,as you continue to breed and train great dogs.
I for one am glad to have you and your insight on the board.
_________________________


"IF YOU'RE GONNA TALK SMART,YOU BETTER RIDE A FAST HORSE"








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#1123670 - 11/30/08 12:49 AM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Duane@ssu]
Devin69 Offline
Die Hard Member II

Registered: 11/16/08
Posts: 1467
Loc: Craig Colorado
Like I said it is a lottery with breeding but if you know the history or the genetics of the dog you can increase your success.
As far as a open mind, that is why i was asking how the dog was bred. I always have a open mind about dogs.
I have owned and tried every breed of hound and crosses. tried Kemmer curs, leopards,Jagd terriers, Airedale terriers, hound terrier crosses, jack russels,border collies.
I currantly own Walker hounds for Bear, Lion, Bobcat.Kemmer curs and a OMC and a Leopard ,kemmer,hound cross and some Jagd terriers and the Airedale for coyotes.
And thanks glad to be here
_________________________
LIGHTNING RIDGE KENNELS Walker breeding at it's best Used to Catch Big Game Our choice is as simple as Black and White

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#1123671 - 11/30/08 08:16 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Devin69]
Duane@ssu Offline
Retired moderator

Registered: 04/24/01
Posts: 4095
Loc: Gods Country
Devin,its a good thing we don't hunt the same country,or I think we could "clean it".I also run all kinds of dogs,from Catahoullas,crosses,a blue healer,a Macnab,some walkers,and a few "ticks".I think I have run a fair share of good dogs as well as dinks.It sure is a fun "game to play though".
I have never had good luck crossing hound and terrier blood.
How has it worked for you?
_________________________


"IF YOU'RE GONNA TALK SMART,YOU BETTER RIDE A FAST HORSE"








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#1123672 - 11/30/08 09:29 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Duane@ssu]
Devin69 Offline
Die Hard Member II

Registered: 11/16/08
Posts: 1467
Loc: Craig Colorado
My lead dog is a Jagd terrier Walker hound cross. She is 14 now I have had her since she was 7 months(she si only good for about one run a week now). I don't know if it was one of those fluke breedings or there is really something to it. I have never heard of anyone doing this. I wish I knew the breeding behind her so I would have some direction to go if I were to make a cross like that again. I have lucked into a female Jagd that has very good tracking ability and trees very good so I think some day I will make this cross with my Lead Male(Walker) and see how things turn out. But one thing you can bet I will keep a record of their ancestery so that if it works I can reproduce it again.
I had a buddy years ago that ran Airedale/Walker crosses on coyotes and loved them. That was back in my days when I was closed minded and I just laughed at him for doing that to a perfectly good hound, now I wish I would have hunted with them to see how they worked.
I love to hear of crazy crosses like that, I feel the dogs we now know were made from crazy crosses like that and I see no reason why we can not take what we have and improve on it. With fur prices down and compition hunts and shows on a rise I think we see our dogs of today going in the oppisite direction of the dog we as hunters are looking for. Anyway that is the way I see it, I have taken great meassures to prevent this from happening to me anyway. I have collected my lead male and have his semen in the bank so I will be able to draw off it for many years to come.
How many of us have lost our best dog and wished we would have got one more pup or a pup out of him before he died?
Sorry Rambling again, Keep those crazy crosses coming, someday they will be introducing your breed into the AKC ,UKC. The "SSU HOUND" I like it
_________________________
LIGHTNING RIDGE KENNELS Walker breeding at it's best Used to Catch Big Game Our choice is as simple as Black and White

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#1123673 - 12/01/08 08:59 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Devin69]
Duane@ssu Offline
Retired moderator

Registered: 04/24/01
Posts: 4095
Loc: Gods Country
Devin, I have more than once "taken some heat" For a cross.
Some worked out and some... well you know.
I have an old dog right now that is 11, with no nuts.I have killed 400 yotes over him.How bad did I screw up with that choice???? I say do the best you can,and if the cross may work,try it and see what happens.I do agree with you on the fact that "Paper is very helpful" My problem is most of the dogs I started will were "culls" that ended up being good dogs.They never had paper.I am though, going to do like the "oldmen" and keep a record of my crosses with my dogs,so as I continue ,I will have a record of sires and dams,grands,and so forth back to when I started.Maybe someday my kids will be glad I did.
As for "competition hunts" I have no interest.I breed dogs to work for me in my world.I have never been to a "hunt".
_________________________


"IF YOU'RE GONNA TALK SMART,YOU BETTER RIDE A FAST HORSE"








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#1123674 - 12/01/08 09:53 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Duane@ssu]
crapshoot Offline
Retired PM Staff

Registered: 03/22/02
Posts: 23113
Loc: Henderson,Nevada,USA
That prospect looks a bit timmid. Just not use to the new surroundings? Good looking hound reguardless.
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#1123675 - 12/02/08 07:20 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: crapshoot]
Duane@ssu Offline
Retired moderator

Registered: 04/24/01
Posts: 4095
Loc: Gods Country
Crapshoot,good observation, he is alittle "wolfy".I been working with him so we can trust each other,and still have a ways to go,but with patience,we are makin progress.It will be a month or so before I can hunt him.The older dog is solid and have had her out once already,and am just waitin for things to settle a bit so I can get out again.
I run her with my other dogs a few nites ago,but I'm in a spot because I have 3 females in heat,and 3 studs wantin to be studs.The new dog was a jewel to hunt with and handle,but my other dogs were bein a pain in the a$$.Besides the weather has been poor for a week.
_________________________


"IF YOU'RE GONNA TALK SMART,YOU BETTER RIDE A FAST HORSE"








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#1123676 - 12/02/08 09:27 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Duane@ssu]
Oklahunter Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/03/05
Posts: 39
Loc: Colorado
Good looking dogs Duane. How old is good dog?

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#1123677 - 12/02/08 10:31 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Oklahunter]
Duane@ssu Offline
Retired moderator

Registered: 04/24/01
Posts: 4095
Loc: Gods Country
She is 4, seems to be OK, need to hunt her more.
_________________________


"IF YOU'RE GONNA TALK SMART,YOU BETTER RIDE A FAST HORSE"








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#3251372 - 08/29/20 06:19 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Duane@ssu]
bugmenot Offline
New Member

Registered: 05/08/14
Posts: 5
Loc: usa
I want to congratulate you that you have found a true friend in the person of a dog. I also recently bought myself a dog spam link , for a long time I wanted such a dog for myself and finally bought myself a faithful friend. The Alaskan Klee Kai is a family dog that does not like to associate with strangers. These dogs choose only one or a few people, to whom they give all their attention and love. I like it the most about my dog, it is better not to find a friend.


Edited by Stu Farish (09/07/21 07:22 PM)

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#3251376 - 08/29/20 07:42 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Duane@ssu]
SlickerThanSnot Online
PM senior

Registered: 01/31/14
Posts: 5772
Loc: stuck in a fence
another thread back from the grave. lol
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skeptical is what i am when told there is a dead coyote in certain far off pictures.

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#3251422 - 08/30/20 11:57 AM Re: New cat dogs [Re: SlickerThanSnot]
Plant.One Offline
Die Hard Member with a vengeance

Registered: 02/12/15
Posts: 4866
Loc: Oakland County, MI
Originally Posted By: SlickerThanSnot
another thread back from the grave. lol



and a low-key advertising dig too... the link while it goes to an about animal profile is a retail site.
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All reloading info shared is based on my experiences in my guns. Follow safe reloading practice and work up loads from published minimum data.
This disclaimer will self destruct in 10 seconds.


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#3251432 - 08/30/20 03:27 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Plant.One]
SlickerThanSnot Online
PM senior

Registered: 01/31/14
Posts: 5772
Loc: stuck in a fence
Originally Posted By: Plant.One
Originally Posted By: SlickerThanSnot
another thread back from the grave. lol



and a low-key advertising dig too... the link while it goes to an about animal profile is a retail site.


oh really. i didn't click on it. lol
_________________________
skeptical is what i am when told there is a dead coyote in certain far off pictures.

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#3252584 - 09/17/20 01:07 PM Re: New cat dogs [Re: Duane@ssu]
Ruger77KH Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/15/20
Posts: 29
Loc: Missouri USA
I got 2 what appears to be black & white curs. abandoned on my property . Really would like to make bobcat mutts out of them they chase my house cat all over but not positive on how to train them for bobcats. I have trained walkers for coon but that's easy.work them on a hide then catch coons and let them figure it out .even trained A walker black& tan mix to rig hunt coons. Kinda hard to catch a bobcat in a live trap without getting in trouble.So do ya just use a drag with cat scent? 1 has a good nose & uses it the other seems to just me too & sight chase everything Or do I just take them to the spot I hunt & have seen bobcats several times & hope for the best. Any tips would be appreciated

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