85 grain Sierra .243 HPBT Gameking
- Thread starter cornstalker
- Start date
One bullet that is a real sleeper is the Speer 85g BTSP. It has a BC of .401 and is a deer bullet, not a varmint bullet. I had much better luck with this bullet on deer. than the Sierra 85g BTHP.
I killed thousands of p. dogs and chucks with the 85g Sierra BTHP.
As I read about how many of the guys have had great luck with this bullet on deer, makes me wonder about lot to lot variations. I shot a buck, and two does in three days and none of them dropped on the spot with them all running about 40-50 yards through some of the thickest jungle that you could imagine. I expect that the muzzle velocity was in the 3100 fps range.
I used the 85g Speer on Deer and antelope out West, and if they ran 50 yards, it was not big deal, but I did get complete penetration. The 90g Speer is another whale of a deer bullet for the 243.
I killed thousands of p. dogs and chucks with the 85g Sierra BTHP.
As I read about how many of the guys have had great luck with this bullet on deer, makes me wonder about lot to lot variations. I shot a buck, and two does in three days and none of them dropped on the spot with them all running about 40-50 yards through some of the thickest jungle that you could imagine. I expect that the muzzle velocity was in the 3100 fps range.
I used the 85g Speer on Deer and antelope out West, and if they ran 50 yards, it was not big deal, but I did get complete penetration. The 90g Speer is another whale of a deer bullet for the 243.
GC
Well-known member
ackleyman,
You are plenty experienced to know a heart/lung shot deer that runs 40 - 50 yards isn't anything to get excited about. That happens with about anything you hit them with. A few drop as if the world was jerked out from under them, and, a few run a short distance. Nothing unusual about either reaction. I have heard good things about that 85 gr. Speer too, though I don't have any personal experience with it. For whatever reason I don't use a lot of Speer bullets. No slight on Speer, I know they make good bullets; they just aren't the first thing I reach for on the dealer’s shelf. In fact, for next year I am going to load the Speer .30 caliber 130 gr. flat point to around 2,600 fps in the .308 Winchester for an easy recoiling load for my 77 year old Dad in his little Browning BLR. I hear really good things about it from .30-30 users that prefer it to all other weights at close to that speed from their lever guns. They all tell stories of super performance on woods range deer, good accuracy, and a flatter trajectory. It was the Speer or a Nosler 125 gr. Ballistic Tip and I think for the cost the Speer will do the job as well and for less money. Those .308 165 grainers at over 2,600 fps from the little BLR are getting to be too much for Pop at his age.
You are plenty experienced to know a heart/lung shot deer that runs 40 - 50 yards isn't anything to get excited about. That happens with about anything you hit them with. A few drop as if the world was jerked out from under them, and, a few run a short distance. Nothing unusual about either reaction. I have heard good things about that 85 gr. Speer too, though I don't have any personal experience with it. For whatever reason I don't use a lot of Speer bullets. No slight on Speer, I know they make good bullets; they just aren't the first thing I reach for on the dealer’s shelf. In fact, for next year I am going to load the Speer .30 caliber 130 gr. flat point to around 2,600 fps in the .308 Winchester for an easy recoiling load for my 77 year old Dad in his little Browning BLR. I hear really good things about it from .30-30 users that prefer it to all other weights at close to that speed from their lever guns. They all tell stories of super performance on woods range deer, good accuracy, and a flatter trajectory. It was the Speer or a Nosler 125 gr. Ballistic Tip and I think for the cost the Speer will do the job as well and for less money. Those .308 165 grainers at over 2,600 fps from the little BLR are getting to be too much for Pop at his age.
Yep, GC, the heart lung shots usually gets them running 50 yards.
GC, you may have to drop down to a 243 for your dad, those old bones just can't take the recoil and a lighter rifle may not hurt either.
Good luck with your dad, I lost mine this year. Try and get him out anytime you can...even if he does not feel good, because it will make him feel better.
GC, you may have to drop down to a 243 for your dad, those old bones just can't take the recoil and a lighter rifle may not hurt either.
Good luck with your dad, I lost mine this year. Try and get him out anytime you can...even if he does not feel good, because it will make him feel better.
gary paugh
New member
Anyone try hornady 87gr hpbt bullets i just bought a box and got a few loaded but haven't made it to the range yet.
I'm hoping to find a load that shoots as well as the 87gr V-max's do for me.
I'm hoping to find a load that shoots as well as the 87gr V-max's do for me.
stanimals2
New member
I loaded some of the Hornady 87,s for my 243 and wasnt that impressed however I also had trouble finding good load info at the time and had to take load and pressure from loads from weights above and below to wags a starting point.
GC
Well-known member
ackleyman,
I don't think I could get dad to give up his beloved old BLR. That's his "deer rifle" and that's all there is to it.
gary,
I use to shoot a lot of the Hornady 87 gr. BTHP bullets. They are considerably more explosive in my experience than the Sierra 85 gr. BTHP. I once called a coyote through the timber to about 80 yards and he checked up watching my little decoy. He was peeking around a tree and I shot him in the right eye with a .243 87 gr. Hornady BTHP pushed by a stout load of IMR-4350 to 3,127 fps. This was a really old coyote male and quite large. The bullet entered the eye and DIDN’T EXIT THE BACK OF THE SKULL. There was gray mush exploded from the coyote’s ears and his skull was completely broken into pieces, yet nothing exited the skin. I hit another coyote as it quartered toward me through the timber at about 45 yards right on the spine. Geez, looked like I tried to fillet that coyote… nasty. I’ve actually heard of guys using the flat base spitzer on antelope and deer, but it would have to be a lot tougher than the BTHP from Hornady for me to consider it. The Sierra BTHP is quite a bit stouter.
I don't think I could get dad to give up his beloved old BLR. That's his "deer rifle" and that's all there is to it.
gary,
I use to shoot a lot of the Hornady 87 gr. BTHP bullets. They are considerably more explosive in my experience than the Sierra 85 gr. BTHP. I once called a coyote through the timber to about 80 yards and he checked up watching my little decoy. He was peeking around a tree and I shot him in the right eye with a .243 87 gr. Hornady BTHP pushed by a stout load of IMR-4350 to 3,127 fps. This was a really old coyote male and quite large. The bullet entered the eye and DIDN’T EXIT THE BACK OF THE SKULL. There was gray mush exploded from the coyote’s ears and his skull was completely broken into pieces, yet nothing exited the skin. I hit another coyote as it quartered toward me through the timber at about 45 yards right on the spine. Geez, looked like I tried to fillet that coyote… nasty. I’ve actually heard of guys using the flat base spitzer on antelope and deer, but it would have to be a lot tougher than the BTHP from Hornady for me to consider it. The Sierra BTHP is quite a bit stouter.
coleridge
New member
I did some "clocking" this weekend with my sons Rem 700 Mtn Guide in .243 w/ a 22" barrel. Last year I had loaded a mild dose of 4064 with the 85gr gameking (that shot GREAT). That load was running 2920fps. He is bigger this year (with more trigger time) so I thought I'd get the good out of the little rifle. I loaded up to the max load listed by Hodgdon with H414 & IMR 4064, 45gr & 40 respectively.
The H414 5 shot group averaged 3264 fps (almost a 350 fps increase /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif)while the 4064 averaged 3140. However, the 4064 load was more accurate, but still not as tight as the "light" load of 4064 we shot last year.
I also loaded up to the max load with the new Hybrid 100V with a 100gr gameking. These broke across at 3053fps. This also shot really good in the rifle.
Decisions, decisions....
The H414 5 shot group averaged 3264 fps (almost a 350 fps increase /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif)while the 4064 averaged 3140. However, the 4064 load was more accurate, but still not as tight as the "light" load of 4064 we shot last year.
I also loaded up to the max load with the new Hybrid 100V with a 100gr gameking. These broke across at 3053fps. This also shot really good in the rifle.
Decisions, decisions....
GC
Well-known member
Good to know and useful info, thanks for posting that. You got some excellent velocities! If they're accurate, they're certainly fast enough. That load with Hybrid 100V is smoking that 100 gr. bullet from a 22" barrel! I haven't tried that powder yet, or the new RE-17 which is supposed to increase velocities over the old standby powders. If they can provide accuracy then they’re certainly worth a look. I didn't get to go shoot this weekend. But it is something I really need to do within the next couple of days. I will do my final fine tuning of my scope setting and chrono my load of 39.5 grains of IMR-4064 with the 85 gr. Sierra BTHP from the 22" barrel of my M7 Predator. It'll be interesting to see what that does. Anything over 3,050 fps will make me happy. I suspect it'll be a bit faster than that. Usually a 22" barrel can break 3,100 fps with an 85 gr. bullet in the .243 without much trouble. Honestly with my limited testing so far I'll have to be satisfied with this load, it is by far the most accurate so whatever velocity it gives will have to do. But I don't think I'll be disappointed. With more time I’ll fiddle with seating depth of that bullet some and try some other bullets and/or weights in the gun to give it a complete wringing out. I’m in a bit of a rush to get it ready for deer season and calling season here. I have other rifles, but a new gun sitting in the safe during hunting season just ain’t right!
cornstalker
Active member
Quote:
One bullet that is a real sleeper is the Speer 85g BTSP. It has a BC of .401 and is a deer bullet, not a varmint bullet. I had much better luck with this bullet on deer. than the Sierra 85g BTHP.
I killed thousands of p. dogs and chucks with the 85g Sierra BTHP.
As I read about how many of the guys have had great luck with this bullet on deer, makes me wonder about lot to lot variations. I shot a buck, and two does in three days and none of them dropped on the spot with them all running about 40-50 yards through some of the thickest jungle that you could imagine. I expect that the muzzle velocity was in the 3100 fps range.
I used the 85g Speer on Deer and antelope out West, and if they ran 50 yards, it was not big deal, but I did get complete penetration. The 90g Speer is another whale of a deer bullet for the 243.
I do like what the BC shows on this bullet. I do have to wonder if the Speer BC's are legit. They tend to show alot higher BC's than other manufacturers of similar bullets. For instance, a .338 Hornady 225 grain flat base is listed at .397 but a Speer 225 grain Boat tail is listed at .484.
Can the "form factor" benefit of a boat tail really make that much difference?
I love the accuracy that I have seen from Speer bullets. Will it hold up to 6-284 velocities at shorter range?
I'd sure be willing to try the Speer bullets as well.....
One bullet that is a real sleeper is the Speer 85g BTSP. It has a BC of .401 and is a deer bullet, not a varmint bullet. I had much better luck with this bullet on deer. than the Sierra 85g BTHP.
I killed thousands of p. dogs and chucks with the 85g Sierra BTHP.
As I read about how many of the guys have had great luck with this bullet on deer, makes me wonder about lot to lot variations. I shot a buck, and two does in three days and none of them dropped on the spot with them all running about 40-50 yards through some of the thickest jungle that you could imagine. I expect that the muzzle velocity was in the 3100 fps range.
I used the 85g Speer on Deer and antelope out West, and if they ran 50 yards, it was not big deal, but I did get complete penetration. The 90g Speer is another whale of a deer bullet for the 243.
I do like what the BC shows on this bullet. I do have to wonder if the Speer BC's are legit. They tend to show alot higher BC's than other manufacturers of similar bullets. For instance, a .338 Hornady 225 grain flat base is listed at .397 but a Speer 225 grain Boat tail is listed at .484.
Can the "form factor" benefit of a boat tail really make that much difference?
I love the accuracy that I have seen from Speer bullets. Will it hold up to 6-284 velocities at shorter range?
I'd sure be willing to try the Speer bullets as well.....
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CatShooter
New member
Quote:
I do like what the BC shows on this bullet. I do have to wonder if the Speer BC's are legit. They tend to show alot higher BC's than other manufacturers of similar bullets. For instance, a .338 Hornady 225 grain flat base is listed at .397 but a Speer 225 [sic] grain Boat tail is listed at .484.
Can the "form factor" benefit of a boat tail really make that much difference?
I love the accuracy that I have seen from Speer bullets. Will it hold up to 6-284 velocities at shorter range?
I'd sure be willing to try the Speer bullets as well.....
"Can the "form factor" benefit of a boat tail really make that much difference?"
No.
Different bullet makers use different methods to arrive at the BC of their bullets - some are very scientific, others are (shall we say), somewhat less than scientific.
If identical bullets were given to all the makers to be evaluated, they would come back with different BCs for them.
It's just one of those things.
Hornady BCs are typically conservative and are lower than the other guys, but their bullets fly flatter and retain more velocity than their competition.
Speer and Nosler are the most "optimistically enhanced" of all the makers.
.
I do like what the BC shows on this bullet. I do have to wonder if the Speer BC's are legit. They tend to show alot higher BC's than other manufacturers of similar bullets. For instance, a .338 Hornady 225 grain flat base is listed at .397 but a Speer 225 [sic] grain Boat tail is listed at .484.
Can the "form factor" benefit of a boat tail really make that much difference?
I love the accuracy that I have seen from Speer bullets. Will it hold up to 6-284 velocities at shorter range?
I'd sure be willing to try the Speer bullets as well.....
"Can the "form factor" benefit of a boat tail really make that much difference?"
No.
Different bullet makers use different methods to arrive at the BC of their bullets - some are very scientific, others are (shall we say), somewhat less than scientific.
If identical bullets were given to all the makers to be evaluated, they would come back with different BCs for them.
It's just one of those things.
Hornady BCs are typically conservative and are lower than the other guys, but their bullets fly flatter and retain more velocity than their competition.
Speer and Nosler are the most "optimistically enhanced" of all the makers.
.
cornstalker
Active member
Quote:
Speer and Nosler are the most "optimistically enhanced" of all the makers.
I suspected that, thanks CS.
Seems like Sierra is probably the most thorough and accurate, but I don't know if I totally buy their "yaw" theory regarding match grade bullets improving in BC as they slow down.
Then again I am no engineer..........
Speer and Nosler are the most "optimistically enhanced" of all the makers.
I suspected that, thanks CS.
Seems like Sierra is probably the most thorough and accurate, but I don't know if I totally buy their "yaw" theory regarding match grade bullets improving in BC as they slow down.
Then again I am no engineer..........
CatShooter
New member
Quote:
Quote:
Speer and Nosler are the most "optimistically enhanced" of all the makers.
I suspected that, thanks CS.
Seems like Sierra is probably the most thorough and accurate, but I don't know if I totally buy their "yaw" theory regarding match grade bullets improving in BC as they slow down.
Then again I am no engineer..........
Their "yaw theory" is bogus, but bullets do change BCs at different velocities.
The problem with Sierra is that they bought into a software package from a group of code writers back when Windows 3.1 was the newest craze...
... and that software is very flawed. So Sierra must test each bullet for a long time and assigned different numbers for different velocity brackets, to make the bullet fit the software - some get higher, and some get lower... not because the bullets really change that way, but because the software is poor.
But Sierra has so much money invested their software, that they can't get out now.
.
Quote:
Speer and Nosler are the most "optimistically enhanced" of all the makers.
I suspected that, thanks CS.
Seems like Sierra is probably the most thorough and accurate, but I don't know if I totally buy their "yaw" theory regarding match grade bullets improving in BC as they slow down.
Then again I am no engineer..........
Their "yaw theory" is bogus, but bullets do change BCs at different velocities.
The problem with Sierra is that they bought into a software package from a group of code writers back when Windows 3.1 was the newest craze...
... and that software is very flawed. So Sierra must test each bullet for a long time and assigned different numbers for different velocity brackets, to make the bullet fit the software - some get higher, and some get lower... not because the bullets really change that way, but because the software is poor.
But Sierra has so much money invested their software, that they can't get out now.
.
Jim n Iowa
New member
I had great shooting with the Sierra 85 g hpbt/ IMR 3031 @35.9g col 2.60" win brass wlr primer. Then the rifle gave up the ghost a few months latter. G. Gridders has tried to save the patient, will have to test it. Its a Parker-Hale I bought used.
Jim
Jim
A great dual purpose bullet, love it in 3 of my 4 .243's, or should I say 3 of my 4 .243's love them. Killed many coyotes and three bucks with this bullet. Longest shot I ever made on a buck was with this bullet out of a Tikka .243, 419 yards on the laser rangefinder. Also like the 100 grain Gameking, Sierra makes great bullets, I try to stay as loyal to them as my rifles will allow.
ironworker
New member
So Ackleyman your saying the Speer 85gr SPBT isn't any good for varmints? And CatShooter your saying the BC on Speer 85gr SPBT isn't .404? I bought those bullets because they were only $14.00 Bucks and the High BC. I shoot those out of a 6x284.Magpro gives me very high velocity 3,650 MV ( No pressure signs)but only marginal accuracy (3/4 MOA) thats with 61.5 grs of Magpro. 53.3 grs of H4350 produced 3418 with a 1/4MOA. That powder charge produces 3500+ with 87gr V-max. Dang I guess I should throw in the towel with the Magpro and the Speer bullets.I want to plug a coyote. Going tomorrow morning shooting my 22-250AI and 80gr Berger VLDs at 3350FPS. I wonder how those will perform on a yote? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smiliesmack.gif
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I shot two deer this year with my .243 win loaded up with 44 gr. varget pdr. and 80 gr. sierra SBT's @ at 3,410 fps almost same bullet, very accurate, bit light for deer honustly, but one of the two deer I shot was a big 4x4 mule deer in Idaho at about 190# or so and at 150 yards, bullet mushroomed on the opposite side of rib cage but did the job, the 85 gr game king should be just totally perfect, not too much and not too little expansion/penetration.
I love the 6mm's, I Personaly am probley gana switch next year to a swift 90 gr. scirro 2 bullet, or a 85 gr. barnes tsx. The 80 sbt's mushroomed and exploded a little too fast. I shot a blacktail in oregon and only had a rear quarter shot and took it and I chased that buck for 300 yards before I could finish him off, lol with his intestens draging the ground and every thing, he didnt want to get tagged and bagged. First time and last time ill rear quarter shoot a deer with a .243 win. Ive done it many times with 7mm rem mag and 30:06 and deer dont go any where. But yes I would say the 85 gr. game king should be fine for deer but maybe a little heavy on a yote, unless your pumping some serious velocity to make it open up fast enough on a little tiny 35 pound coyote. I prefer the 65 gr. rounds for yotes, much more killing power on yotes.
I love the 6mm's, I Personaly am probley gana switch next year to a swift 90 gr. scirro 2 bullet, or a 85 gr. barnes tsx. The 80 sbt's mushroomed and exploded a little too fast. I shot a blacktail in oregon and only had a rear quarter shot and took it and I chased that buck for 300 yards before I could finish him off, lol with his intestens draging the ground and every thing, he didnt want to get tagged and bagged. First time and last time ill rear quarter shoot a deer with a .243 win. Ive done it many times with 7mm rem mag and 30:06 and deer dont go any where. But yes I would say the 85 gr. game king should be fine for deer but maybe a little heavy on a yote, unless your pumping some serious velocity to make it open up fast enough on a little tiny 35 pound coyote. I prefer the 65 gr. rounds for yotes, much more killing power on yotes.