sending carlson's tube back

COYKILL

COYKILL

New member
I shot my Mossberg 835 again today using my turkey loads and the Carlson's dead coyote choke tube and it patterned nice(just to see how the gun was shooting) but when I shot the Hevi-shot dead Coyote T shot it was bad. 3-5 hits in a 10" circle at 40 yards. Had the gun on sand bags. Scott at Carlsons said to try my stock choke tube and it was 6 in a 10" cicle. He told me to send their tube back and he will send me a .675 tube to try. At 50 yards it will be worse so I will try the new tube because I don't feel good the way it is shooting now. They are good to work with evan though I am spending a lot on shells. I may try the Federal Hevy Weight Coyote.
 
Too tight a choke with ANY tungsten based load will pattern poorly. I think a factory full is fine for any such load, and that is what I use for the Hevi Shot Dead Coyote. Some folks even use a modified.
 

I have the Carlson's tube and also a Trulock .670. Both are similar, but the Trulock seems to give a few more pellets on target. If you are trying different tubes, you might want to give Trulock a go. They are great people to deal with.
 
I called Carlson's back again(talked with someone different this time)and talked to shane about how my gun is patterning with their .695 dead coyote choke tube and the Hevi-shot Dead Coyote T-shot and he said I am getting bad patterns because it is to restrictive and said a smaller tube would be worse with more pressure. He said to send it back for a .705 tube.
 
He's probably right, the Mossberg 835 has that huge overbore 10 gauge sized barrel of .775" diameter. I found in my testing that somewhere between .050" - .065" of constriction seemed to be a sweet spot for the denser than lead tungsten shot of BB and T size, along with plated lead No. Four Buck. For the Mossberg 835 that would be a choke of between .710" - .725", so it would seem you are moving in the right direction. The .695" choke was giving a massive .080" constriction - way too much IMHO.
 

GC,

I have been playing around a bit with the Remington Wingmaster HD BB loads lately in my Remington 11-87. I am using the Trulock .670 choke.

The loads are doing pretty good at 35 yards, but I was hoping for a bit tighter pattern.

If you had to experiment with a tube that might shoot a bit tighter, what constriction would you recommend? Also, how are the BB loads working out for you?


BB.jpg
 
For comparison I am getting 10 - 12 hits in 8" at point of aim at a measured 50 yards. At 40 yards I consistently average 27 hits in 8" at point of aim. I am using a Kick's GT choke at .670" that gives me about .053" constriction from my Benelli bore. Your Remington bore should measure about .729" and the .670" choke is about .059" constriction from your bore size. It's only a guess, but I would probably try a .665" choke and see if that tightened things up a tad with the 3" Wingmaster HD-BB or Dead Coyote T's. If it didn't... then go the opposite direction and look at a .675" choke. It is like searching for that perfect combination of case, primer, powder, bullet, bullet weight, seating depth, ect. for your rifle. I know you understand how aggravating that can be at times.

As to on game performance since doing all that pattern work about three years ago I've killed enough coyotes and fox to get a real good feel for it now compared to the No. Four Buck I used for years before. I like the HD-BB better. Under 40 yards depending upon how well your gun patterns you might not notice much difference. Having said that I think I do see a difference because I'm sending a bunch of those hard little BB's in a real tight pattern and they're just smashing coyotes. I hate to say it because I complain about it all the time, but I have misjudged the range and shot a few at closer to 60 yards than the 50 I'd like to keep my shots within. Sometimes ya gotta keep on the trigger and apply more tungsten, but they haven't let me down yet and the need to shoot multiple times with a shotgun isn't anything new. If a guy has no need to shoot far, then the least expensive route is the good old No. Four Buck in lead. From a good shooting rig No. Four Buck won't let you down either. If you want the absolute best bone breaking and deepest penetrating shot - then tungsten is it. That's my personal experience anyway.
 

Thanks GC for the info. That's good to hear. I keep looking for more shot on target (like everyone else) and was hoping to find a smaller shot that would penetrate well and yet have enough pellets to give a good pattern. That's what I was hoping to find with the HD BBs.

I'll be searching for some choke tubes to try also. Suggestions? Is there anything out there that is any better than the others?

I'm more of a rifleman than shotgun, so I look for some advice in that department.

For compairson, I just now measured 8" on the target above. I did an 8" square from point of aim, and not a circle. I have 23 hits within the square, but that's from 35 yards.


Remington Wingmaster HD BB, outside square = 8 inches

DSC00154.jpg



I also shot some Hevi-Shot, #4 fine shot at 35 yards. I'm sure it's not in the same league as BB loads.

DSC00156.jpg



 
6mm06,

I also shoot a Rem, & the advice given by GC pretty much mirrors the results of my gun. I have a friend that owns a local pawn/gun shop, so I was able to shoot several different choke/shot size combinations (without having to buy the chokes) through my gun & had the best patterns out of a .665 choke with the 3" HD BBs. It wasn't much better than the .670 that I already owned though, so I ended up sticking with it, & I'm confident in my setup out to 50yds. It took 3 or 4 shots with each choke to see that the .665 was a little better overall, and that may be the ticket to get your gun where you want it.
 
One other thing, I've yet to get a very good pattern with the T shot out of my gun no matter what combination I try. I can get decent patterns out of 3" #4 buck, but I don't think it's as effective as the HD BBs, especially at longer ranges.
 

Thanks Cookstaxi,

I'm going to give a .665 choke a try. While my .670 isn't doing too bad, I have always felt it should be a tad bit tighter.

I've shot Dead Coyote and #4 Buck loads of both Remington and Winchester Supreme. They shoot good too, but I just want more, if that's possible.

The BB loads seem to me to be about right with pellet size vs. number of pellets on target. I'm thinking fox, bobcats and coyotes with the HD BBs.

Do you think a .660 choke be too tight? My understanding is that going too tight sometimes can actually open up the pattern.




 
I would go the other way if the .665 doesn't get you where you want to be. I started with a .655 & opened up from there including the .660. I had the best patterns with the .665 & .670 & from there the patterns started getting a little wild, but the .675 had better patterns out of my gun than the tighter chokes so I would think that if the .665 isn't better than your current setup then you probably need to open up some.
 
I finally shot my Mossberg 835 again today with the tube Carlsons exchanged for me. I had there .695 and then exchanged it for a .705 and it was better but still not good. inside a 10" cicle I had 7 hits one time and 8 hits another time. 42 & 39 total hits inside of the 30" circle at 40 yards. They are now going to send me a .727 to try and see what that does. What do you think? Using Hevi Shot Dead Coyote T shot. I ordered some Feaderal Copper Plated #4 Buck but I won't be able to use that at nightime in Mich.
 
Finally received the .727 choke tube from Carlson's and shot it a little while ago. Shot it twice and I am happy with it now with 12 hits inside the 10 circle and 11 hits the other time. 40 yards each time.
 
Originally Posted By: COYKILLI finally shot my Mossberg 835 again today with the tube Carlsons exchanged for me. I had there .695 and then exchanged it for a .705 and it was better but still not good. inside a 10" cicle I had 7 hits one time and 8 hits another time. 42 & 39 total hits inside of the 30" circle at 40 yards. They are now going to send me a .727 to try and see what that does. What do you think? Using Hevi Shot Dead Coyote T shot. I ordered some Feaderal Copper Plated #4 Buck but I won't be able to use that at nightime in Mich.

Glad to hear your starting to get some good results. You might want to try a couple of shots with the HD BBs. I got much better patterns with them than I did with the Dead Coyote T shot out of my gun. You'll have more pellets, & if T shot is legal the BBs should be also. They're plenty big enough to get the job done as well.


6mm06, give us an update on your testing.
 
Originally Posted By: COYKILLwhat is HD BB

I was referring to the Remington Wingmaster HD BBs. The HD stands for high density (denser than lead). BB is the shot size. It will really break a coyote up, & I prefer it over the #4 buck especially at longer ranges.
 
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